cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/15988326
Windows 10 will reach end of support on October 14, 2025. The current version, 22H2, will be the final version of Windows 10, and all editions will remain in support with monthly security update releases through that date. Existing LTSC releases will continue to receive updates beyond that date based on their specific lifecycles.
Source: https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/products/windows-10-home-and-pro
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I’ve got money on Microsoft putting a dead man switch in the last win10 update
I’m picturing in my mind, that they’ll add an overlay that takes up your whole screen on login after October '25 that’ll just say “Upgrade to Windows 11 now!” That you can’t close.
At this point, I can use Linux for most things except older fangames, reliable printing (seriously, cups is pain), and some mmorpgs.
Once I get a month without the university shitting its pants and changing policy overnight, I’ll eat the learning curve and switch (actually learn to troubleshoot wine rather than relying on searches).
When I move, thinking mint with cinnamon because I love that desktop.
Being serious: what MMORPG or old game isn’t able to run on Proton or Wine by now?
Literally everything I’ve tossed at Linux Mint and told “use proton 9” has just worked? Currently playing the most heavily modded FNV run I’ve ever done while also experiencing actually 0 crashes for the first time and I’m not actually 100% sure how that’s happening?
I’ve been shocked with Linux’s game capabilities through proton 9 at this point and would love to hear of a use case where it’s not working just to see if I could get it working for the fun of it if I get some time
I have had pretty much no problems printing, probably because I got a good printer (Brother laser printer). It just works every time.
cups is pain
It’s hilarious because it was FAR easier for me to get printing going on my Linux machine than with W10. It’s an old printer, 1320n from HP, maybe 15 years old, but the damn thing is amazing for document printing, and I had to hunt for drivers and do a lot of compatibility shit to get my computer to recognize it. Arch (EndeavourOS) seemed to just natively recognize the printer and gave me zero fuss. When I was using Ubuntu, I used CUPS and it wasn’t terrible. I liked it better than driver fishing, for sure.
Lucky I already upgraded OS to not include any Micro$hit.
I’ve heard you can pay to continue updates on Win10 for three years I believe it was.
Yeah but who is going to do that outside business customers with strict requirements? Raise your hand if you ever even paid for a Windows license in the first place (other than one that came with the PC).
Any guide on how to buy used laptops?
Buy what businesses buy in bulk (e.g. thinkpad x1)
Step 1. Go onto Craigslist or similar
Step 2. Search for used laptops
Step 3. Pay for laptop
Step 4. Profit
Then what ?
gooning session
Yeah it’s nice to know I have to build a new machine next year whether I want to or not. I’ve been coasting on a desktop PC I built circa 2015 because the thing works still. Problem is it doesn’t meet the hardware reqs (TPM 2.0) to upgrade to Win 11.
Whether I build a machine in 2025 or not I think I will be making the switch to daily driving Linux. I am sick of the amount of time the end user has to spend debloating Windows and blocking its telemetry.
So September 2025ish is when I need to decide which Linux distro to go with.
Why wait with the switch until 2025?
Because theres no need to buy new hardware until then and the planned parts might get cheaper or a new deal is offered.
For example my planned motherboard was on sale with a local seller because they opened a new location and offered a 20% discount on Asus parts.
I think they meant why wait to switch to Linux not the why wait to purchase newer hardware.
Yup, They did.
You can start by putting Linux on that old machine. I’d use Linux Mint to begin with.
Their hardware requirents don’t make sense at all. I’ve built my new PC last summer with the best AMD tech available and I don’t meet the requirements for some reason.
You can bypass the TPM 2.0 requirements by pulling in your Windows 11 ISO into Rufus and then selecting to remove the TPM requirement in the prompt.
Drawback is when updating to new major releases of win11 (so I’ve heard) that you have to edit the registry.Just going Linux is way cleaner.
Well this will be the month where I install PopOS
i cant access my laptops bios anymore tho after installing pop os
systemctl reboot --firmware-setupThat will reboot to UEFI setup instantly.
I’d recommend doing a dual boot sooner and slowly shifting your files & apps. It took me about 3 months to find a distro and desktop environment i like, get my apps or alternatives installed, and get used to it.
If you wait until EOL, you may be overwhelmed and frustrated, increasing the likelihood of calling quits and accepting Windows 11.
Thanks for the advice. I have run Fedora in the past so I have an idea of the alternatives I need. I will probably listen to your wisdom and dual boot
I’m enjoying Pop_OS for 3 months now. No issues.
and we still can’t get vmware to run properly on our company laptops. current theory is p/e core scheduling shenanigans. it’s only been two years, what can you expect from the global leaders in virtualization and os.
i swear, before i upgrade I’ll move my team to Linux. I’ve been mainlining debian for six years without issues, INCLUDING RUNNING VMWARE.
Dude fuck VMWare honestly
I’d bet any money they will go under in a few years, nobody is deploying a new vmware system after the shit Broadcom pulled
Who knows, by then Broadcom may drive VMware into the ground too, making the whole thing moot!
we use vmware because customers do. if they migrate - which they might because of the licensing thing - we will too. so it’s an actual possibility already.
fingers crossed!
It will be interesting to see how this impacts the market share lol.
Probably not much, sadly.
Yeah, IMO the majority of people that can switch to Linux already have. The rest are locked in by software they need for their livelihood that only works on Windows. Ofc you can tell them about WINE, but that doesn’t always work very well and is outside of the comfort zone for most people (including me, who’s been using Ubuntu since 2016).
Assuming I still have my current job at that time, this is really going to suck for me. I have an old virtual PC runnning Windows 10 that I use once in a while to maintain some shitty old software. It was a giant PITA setting it up. I regularly back it up because of that.
Hopefully I can just continue using it, but I’ll need to disconnect it from the internet somehow. Will still need some limited LAN access. I guess it will require some strict firewall rules. I know just enough about networking to muddle through…maybe.
Put it on its own vlan behind a firewall and permit only what is required.
Lemmy probably isn’t the target audience for this, here’s the steps to bypass the MS account requirement when setting up W11:
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Configure your keyboard, but before you select your wifi network press Shift+(Fn)+F10 to open Command Prompt.
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Type in the following command and press enter. Your computer will reboot: oobe\bypassnro
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After the reboot, configure your keyboard and location settings, and click the option at the bottom of the page to say that you don’t want to connect to the internet
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Click the link on the next page to “Continue with limited setup”, then follow the prompts to enter a username and password.
If you use rufus to make a windows usb you can select to not require Microsoft account and bypass tpm right in the program, just get a windows 11 iso off the site instead of media creation tool
Having checked a few Reddit threads by the Rufus dev, this seems the way to go!
I wouldn’t try it for a permanent machine as it could backfire when Microsoft trys to enforce it and could lock up the machine somehow (because bigs not because evil corpo)
Also, if you have windows 11 pro, you can do:
Sign in options Domain join instead Make local account
If you have windows 11 home you can:
put no@thankyou.com Use whatever as the password Hit next after the error message Make local account
I do this shit at least three times a week at my job. It’s the fuckin worst.
Lemmy is exactly the audience for this, thanks!
It just seems like there are are more Linux users because they’re constantly bleating about it in smug, self-congratulary comments
Thank you. Now that I’ve showed you my appreciation, are you fucking kidding me?
Great mini guide.
I love the weasel words “continue with limited setup” that Microsoft uses.
I agree, but I find something else even more weasel-y and annoying when I’m adding a second user to an already-configured W11 computer. If I’m adding them as a local account without a Microsoft account, I’ll use Tab to navigate through the process of creating a username, password, and security questions. After the last security question, I’ll hit tab to navigate to the “Okay” button at bottom left of the window, which seems like a reasonable expectation. Instead, Windows will highlight the “Back” button at the bottom right. If you aren’t paying attention and hit enter or space bar, you have to start all the way back at the beginning.
I know that is a small dumb complaint, but when I’m setting 5 computers up in a row and tabbing through everything, my habits get the better of me, and I’ll have to redo it two or three times out of the five.
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Yeah… I’m not gonna worry about it until maybe September next year.
September, the year after… maybe.
Do I trust hackers or Microsoft less with my gaming partition?
What a coincidence. I had to install a W11 machine for a relative. The amount of backward decision in the first 20 minutes of checking the settings is mind boggling. Really? Can’t open the start menu on “all apps”? Not even an option?
I got a new machine and put windows on it and the amount of registry tweaks to get it even close to my windows 10 is ridiculous. Significantly more than what I had to do to 10 to make it a bit more like 7 back in the day. (I know i know get linux, but you can’t play Dragon Ball FighterZ online with linux and that’s the game I play the most)
Fortunately, the number of Linux compatible games is increasing, and companies are actually considering Linux support now for games. I doubt that particular game will get Linux multiplayer support (who knows!), but maybe the next game you get into will!
So for anyone else who reads this: give Linux a shot! If it doesn’t work for your games, try again in a year or so.
Oh 100% give Linux a try. I run pop-os on my 10 year old gaming laptop and it runs way better than it ever did on windows. I’m sure if I put Linux on my desktop it would be even better. I just play too much dbfz and the console version has way too much latency for me to have fun on it anymore
Windows has been more about telling you what you want instead of being intuitive for a few iterations now.
“Intuitive” is basically telling you what you want and being right about it.
The opposite of telling you what you want isn’t being intuitive, it’s being flexible and customizable.
Ok sure. But I think we can all agree when we click the start menu we don’t want “recommended” apps. I don’t want to click start and click apps to see the list.
I also can’t be the only one that hates clicking start or pressing the windows key and typing in “word” or something then have it taken a bazillion years to search the web, and have hit or miss results or whether it suggests the app or some shitty web results.
It’s also counter intuitive to remove features that already exist. Like right clicking the start button for useful shortcuts. Or right clicking the task bar for other things like the task manager (which they ended up bringing back, surprisingly). They also removed moving the task bar. These are things that already existed. They removed them. They didn’t need to rebuild them. They were deliberate.
I really want to see the EU force Microsoft to release a stripped down version that continues to support older hardware.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see the EU require M$ to remove the artificial requirements and let 10 users on older hardware update.
Why? Only hardcore computer nerds would ever want that.
A devastating amount of computer hardware is about to be e-wasted because they decided to drop support for anything older than roughly 2017/2018.
It’s an arbitrary limitation as people have succeeded in forcing it to work on much older hardware that still works well enough for your avg person.
Additionally, windows used to be a tool now it’s a platform for them to essentially market any number of things and user privacy appears to be the least important thing on the table.
The only reason we don’t see mass adoption of Linux has been 4 decades of software development and marketing that let’s them continue to wear their crown.
A regulatory party needs to humble them and return windows to being a tool.
Imagine if the gasoline companies one day announced that they will be changing gas so only cars bought in the last 5 years or so could refuel.
Now imagine if to buy a car you had to tolerate cameras and other forms of tracking your telemetry just to get to work and feed yourself.
Lunacy yes? They took the “my” out of my computer.
Now imagine if to buy a car you had to tolerate cameras and other forms of tracking your telemetry just to get to work and feed yourself.
Sorry to be the bearer of depressing news, but that’s basically already happening in new cars.
https://jacobin.com/2024/03/car-spying-insurance-surveillance-data/
The real thing stopping mass adoption of Linux is that few people want to fiddle around with their machines to that degree. For the vast majority of users, it just needs to run and be able to run whatever programs are needed, and the easier it is to do so, the better.
The majority of computer owners use their machine to open a web browser and maybe an email client.
Surely that can be done on any OS.
Correct, and those people aren’t going to jump through hoops finding a distro and drivers when they can just install windows and call it a day
This
And when I run into issues, I would rather be using the OS that is the most common so that I have more options to get good info for a fix. I don’t want problems that nobody’s ever encountered, or for which the fix is beyond my limited technical ability.
It’s somewhat amusing when I see people on Lemmy proselytizing for Linux and literally while laying out their points to convince someone how easy it is, they’ll talk about doing shit that is already beyond my ability. And I’m not some 90 year old who struggles to turn it on. I’m just a user that doesn’t care to use any OS that I’ll need to take time to learn to figure out how to use it.
When I start a Windows machine I just do what I need to do.
When even a Linux cheerleader is trying to convince someone how easy it is, they’re already indicating more effort than I want to put into it.
Imagine if the gasoline companies one day announced that they will be changing gas so only cars bought in the last 5 years or so could refuel.
They’ve already effectively did this, and by they I mean the US government mandated it. 5% ethanol has been mandated since 2006, and 10% since 2012. If your car is too old (lots of 90s cars) you’ll have to find a gas station that has ethanol free fuel.
I’ve read this a few times. If ethanol is mandated how are there stations with ethanol free? Do they just have a pay an extra tax or something?
It’s allowed for certain types of vehicles, so people illicitly put it in to regular vehicles as well and gas stations turn a blind eye.
It’s not illicit to put non ethanol gas in any vehicle, and even if it were would you actually expect gas stations to confirm the type of vehicle that’s getting fuel for every transaction before the customer is allowed to swipe their card and fill up?
You may be confusing ethanol free gas with off road diesel, which is basically just lower taxed and not dyed. Even then it’s not up to the gas station to police who buys it.
I think actually I was thinking the extra-high octane gas labeled ‘for collector vehicles only’.
Why should they have to support Windows 10 when Linux would run fine on your ‘old’ machine? That really puts the ‘yours’ back in your computer, no need for a company to do it for you.
Yeah and abandon so much in the process.
Linux is wonderful and works plenty fine, but as a civilization we are not ready. There’s still so much that won’t work out of the box, for most manufacturers it’s an after thought if any at all.
You can’t walk into your avg store and be like I want a computer with Linux that will play fortnite.
You can’t blindly buy a video game or a multifunctional printer without serious consideration.
Unlike Windows where it’s the established norm that it will work 100% of the time.
Sure you can argue that a user should just learn to deal with that and teach themselves how to install Linux and cope with whatever comes up.
But that’s just unfair to grandma and anyone else that hasn’t made computers a hobby.
I have two Surface Pros that are BIOS locked so I can’t install Linux. They also don’t support Win11.
I’m not sure what I can do with them.
I am full of rage by proxy, sorry to hear that. I’ve been thinking of only buying coreboot motherboards from now on, but that’s easier said than done.
Fun fact, there were still computers being manufactured with CPUs that don’t support Windows 11 in 2020, got one of those at work that we will need to replace before then. Thankfully only one, so it’s not too big of a deal.
Because a bunch of government and business uses 10 and they really don’t want “Recall AI” in there for a plethora of reasons.
Then they can use LTSC until 2027 or pay for extended service until 2028. After that, they’ll just be unsupported.
I’m sure there’s going to be a group policy setting to disable the Recall AI thing anyway.
Kind of feels like giving my toddler a loaded gun, but saying that it’s safe because the safety is on.
>.>
<.<
…no reason.
Shouldn’t they just support Linux more? Maybe fund some driver development but otherwise - win?
I’m not too familiar with that side of things but I do believe they do. My understanding is that some organizations are set up as nonprofits and they contribute to the development of Linux.
Some European governments also use foss software for things like email and office.
But it’s easier to throw darts at a big company than lots of small things that add up to something big.
One would think.
Linux costs next to nothing compared to Windows. So if companies want to cry about having to save on budget, go with the better option for it.
Who the fuck needs Office 365? Nothing has really changed on that software for years, it’s still the same shit. I don’t see anything different on Microsoft Word 2007 from it’s 365 counterpart. People are getting scammed.
BuT It HaS aI SuPpOrT NoW!
What a selling point.
The UI keeps changing…
My gf recently took one of those dumb ability tests on Indeed for an office job, shows you two screenshots of document editing and you answer which buttons achieve the desired effect. I opened Word on my laptop and all of the buttons were in different places compared to screenshots.
MS, just go sit down somewhere and stop fiddling with shit
Can they do that?
It’s not out of the realm of possibility. They have been known to force Microsoft to make changes in the past. As well as Apple and other major software companies.
Edit: Grammar
It already exists. Most of the requirements that break with current W10 machines are artificial and can be removed at install time with rufus (memory requirement, secure boot, TPM2, microsoft account).
Still not a solution; you should not have to fight against your OS design choices that much.
Hi, KDE. Can we be friends?
