Vance is one of Trump’s most vocal supporters and an outspoken critic of U.S. aid to Ukraine.
. . .
Vance has said that it would be “completely irresponsible” for Ukraine to join NATO. He has also argued for the U.S. to focus solely on preventing Chinese expansion, even if that means sacrificing sovereign Ukrainian lands to Russia.
“Any peace settlement is going to require some significant territorial concessions from Ukraine, and you’re gonna have a peace deal, because that’s the only way out of the conflict,” Vance said in February.
This is Trump’s exact stance as well. He’s been VERY clear about this, but idiots in the conservative camp seem to deliberately ignore it.
I’ve been on the outside observing this escalating shit show for 8 years now and I think I’ve finally reached the point where I don’t even have the words to convey what I feel about the current state of American politics.
I mean, I know there’s a lot of history behind it etc., but just the past months? I don’t even…
I hope shit gets better for ya’ll, I sincerely do.
Don’t worry about it, a lot of us in the US feel the same. I’m just tired, boss.
don’t even have the words to convey what I feel about the current state of American politics.
It’s just fascism, volks.
Don’t worry. It won’t. As an American, I too have reached that point as well.
Putin is behind all of it
I’m Finnish, so if there’s one thing I’m aware of it is Putin and his various machinations.
He’s not. He didn’t put a gun to the head of the judges que made the president immune to prosecution. He didn’t punt a gun to the politicians denying climate change. He didn’t call on Trump’s followers to storm the US capitol. All of that was the US and it’s people.
Putin was probably just cheerleading his puppets as it all happened. But make no mistake, seeds only grow in fertile soil.
🤮
What’s the lead time on T-shirt printing these days?
Should I get the “Hang JD Vance” shirts printed now so I’ve got them ready to sell, or wait until Trump inevitably turns on him?
Picture of him.
DON’T MISS
Vance is going to push Trump down a flight of stairs his first five minutes in office. He’s going to invoke the 25th amendment so fast it’ll make your head spin.
The guy has absolutely no interest in being VP and his buddies in Silicon Valley are already chomping at the bit for a Techbro Coup. He’s not going to wait 3 hours much less 3 days.
The concept of a Techbro coup is so fucking absurd to me. Like I can recognize it as a threat, but also I suspect it would last a whole of five seconds until you have a pile of Techbro corpses. Mostly cause Techbros are the dumbest motherfuckers and only have soft power, add on to the fact that nobody fucking likes them and well theres a good chance theyd be mulched.
Like I can recognize it as a threat, but also I suspect it would last a whole of five seconds until you have a pile of Techbro corpses.
Plenty of the coups in Latin America and the Middle East during the 50s and 60s were sponsored by these bean-counters and their billionaire buddies working out of various right-wing think tanks. The Chicago School of Business produced legions of these fuckers and flew them out from Mexico City to Santiago to Brasília. The Saudi Crown Prince MBS has absolutely inundated himself with these freaks in his quest to build the world’s most technologically advanced shopping mall. New Zealand is currently drowning in Techbro fascism, after their local media was hijacked by the far right and the residents talked into electing a white nationalist government.
Hell, states like California and Texas and Florida are already thick with these ghouls. That’s a big reason why our energy prices are skyrocketing in these states. Techbros build these enormous power-hog data centers and jack up the price of electricity for everyone else.
Techbros are the dumbest motherfuckers and only have soft power
They have a great deal of institutional power through contracts with federal and state governments. They’re embedded deep in the post-War on Terror panopticon and own huge stakes in private media, so they get to dictate a lot of what we see and hear while distorting public outcries and SWATing political dissidents.
Techbros aren’t the brightest, but cops are way dumber and more easy to manipulate. And as our domestic budget increasingly becomes “Oops! All Cops!” that means obedience to the Techbro Establishment is how you make money and keep your job, especially as law enforcement.
That’s huge leverage in a system that already favors extremist ultra-nationalist white supremacy.
Dont take my amusement as dismissal, its foolish to underestimate ones enemy. Everything you said is decently true, hell I should know my great grandfather helped run the proto Techbros out of the region back in the 70s. No the weakness of the fascistic Techbro is that they are inherently institutional, anything that works outside of it or doesnt follow procedures is inherently at an advantage against them. Do you really think Musk or Thiel consider that someone may just blow them up with a car bomb or shoot them point blank with a 12 gauge?
Their power is drawn from the institutions making them inherently a secondary power behind the actual fascist leadership. They have influence dont get me wrong, but it is unlikely that they could hold a fascist government together. The fascist respects strength, but the Techbros have none. They hide behind laws, money, and influence.
They have influence dont get me wrong, but it is unlikely that they could hold a fascist government together.
That’s just fascism generally speaking. You either liberalize or you fail. A paranoid personality cult of an administration can’t last long without people Operation Valkyrie-ing each other, as evidence by Trump’s ear going missing last weekend.
But in the meantime, you get to restructure the liberal order so that your people are in charge when the dust settles.
The point I am trying to make is that to even get to the point where they can set shit up for the future they first must get past the first hurdle of consolidation. Very few Techbros can develop the personality cult required, even the ones with a personality cult are still not strong enough in personality to grow it, look at musk for an example. They are dangerous but mostly as the backers of a fascist, by themselves theyre less dangerous than a sleep deprived redneck with a shovel.
Very few Techbros can develop the personality cult required, even the ones with a personality cult are still not strong enough in personality to grow it, look at musk for an example.
That’s why they introduce guys like Vance, though. He’s a great front-man for the operation because liberals continue to treat him as just another moderate midwestern politician. And he’s proven his star power, with his movie and book deal.
They are dangerous but mostly as the backers of a fascist, by themselves theyre less dangerous than a sleep deprived redneck with a shovel.
I guess we’ll see…
3 to 10 days. Quantity? Colors? Cotton weight ?
I’m not complaining. Only way I’d be happier with his VP pick is if he took up Rubio and forced him to give up Florida.
Vance is also a snake and he’ll backstab the orange man at some point most likely.
Vance is a cuck. He was a harsh critic of Trump until he wasn’t.
I don’t see how Vance gets Trump any extra votes. They appear to attract the same kind of people.
If they win, it gets Vance out of my state. Which is fine (I voted for Tim Ryan).
Vance is there so Trump can scapegoat him for handing Putin everything he wants, that’s about it.
Vance is a cuck.
Politics aside, are we shaming people for their sexual kinks now, if they’re not harming anybody?
if they’re not harming anybody?
Funny that you think people like J.D. Vance aren’t harming people…
Politics aside
Fuck off.
Yes.
I’ll give you whatever answer you want in the hopes you’ll go away.
Those who want to ban my kinks should not have theirs respected
Unless their kink id humiliation, then theyre 100% valid
Ordinarily yes, but the second you try to ban porn or gay people, your fetishes no longer deserve respect and neither do you.
The joke was that people with a humiliation kink would want to be disparaged, so “respecting” them is giving them not what they want
All I need to see is that beard / haircut
I didn’t know that India was big into Hitler. But now his wife’s actions make more sense.
Can you imagine this clown being president when the rapist with 34 felonies is deemed unfit for office or has a McHeartattack?
Sound about right. No need to fund this slaughter.
When a war will break out on your land, don’t fight back, don’t ask for help. Surrender everything to anyone, because you don’t want a slaughter even if it means getting everything stolen, including your freedom, your identity and your civil liberties, right?
Fighting back makes them a terrorist.
Unless the land is strategically advantageous to America then they are freedom fighters.
He unironically probably will when the magats come for him and his own
Ukraine should fight back. Americans shouldn’t fund war. See how easy this is?
Do you actually believe that Americans are singlehandedly funding Ukraine’s defence?
You bring up an excellent point. America doesn’t have to provide further support, because they aren’t single handedly funding Ukraine.
https://www.ifw-kiel.de/topics/war-against-ukraine/ukraine-support-tracker/
So should Poland, the Baltics, Germany and so on? The whole Europe should crumble to the US’ enemies? How can it be in the American best interest?
The EU can fund its own wars?
So now all EU countries need to develop and store their own nuclear weapons since the nuclear umbrella provided by the U.S. is gone. This would be the largest proliferation of nukes in generations.
The US has agreements to defend their allies. Ukraine isn’t an ally.
Why hand an easy win to putin so that he can continue rolling over democracies and vomiting more genocides in order to use their populations to further destroy democracies and commit more cultural genocides? Do you want as many authoritarian countries as possible?
You have no idea what Putin’s goal is so don’t pretend as if you have some deep insight. The EU can fund its own wars.
Just what Putin has allowed his state run media to say. Ukraine is not a real country and others are next. They also want Alaska back so that needs to be given up immediately to prevent bloodshed right?
Source?
I’m not going to show you how to use a search engine but here is the first of many examples after seconds of searching.
They’re only in danger because we took their nukes. They literally left themselves defenseless under the agreement that we would serve as their alternative.
Forgot the /s?
I agree that Ukraine has lost land due to the US/NATO stopping Russia-Ukraine peace deals and talks in 2022.
I am anti-war, so peace deals should be at the forefront; war is a Last Resort[1].
Many on the ‘far left’ and ‘far right’ say:
NATO is a terrorist organization.
[1] Papa Roach - Last Resort 2020 (Explicit) [03:22 | Rap, Rock, USA, In English, Rap Metal, Mental Health, Metal, Alternative Metal, Nu-Metal] https://youtu.be/D2Jl27lYExU
If you are anti-wat, you hoyos be against Russia starting them in the first place or at the very least support making it not worth it in the future. Forcing Ukraine to give up territory is neither of those.
What peace deals were those? Must’ve missed them.
It was a peace deal where Russia would have withdrawn to Feb 23 2022 positions, hostilities would stop and Ukraine would agree not to join NATO. Boris Johnson flew in and said that NATO would give them money to keep fighting. Fast forward two years later and we have tens of thousands more dead Ukrainians and much more lost territory, and a terrible negotiating position.
Please cite an official Russian source putting forward that offer.
I mean it’s not hard to Google “Boris Johnson Ukraine Deal”:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/apr/22/boris-johnson-ukraine-2022-peace-talks-russia
“As Charap and Radchenko show, the reality is a bit more complicated. Johnson didn’t directly sabotage a ceasefire deal in spring 2022; indeed, there was no deal ready to be signed between Russia and Ukraine. The two sides hadn’t agreed on territorial issues, or on levels of military armaments permitted after the war. Ukraine’s position during the negotiations necessitated security guarantees that western states were hesitant to provide. And there were domestic political questions inside Ukraine related to Russian demands about “denazification” to contend with.”
So, no, it’s not as cut and dried as CableMonster makes it out to be. There was no fixed “deal” ready to go, at best it was a negotiation.
As Charap and Radchenko show, the reality is a bit more complicated. Johnson didn’t directly sabotage a ceasefire deal in spring 2022; indeed, there was no deal ready to be signed between Russia and Ukraine. The two sides hadn’t agreed on territorial issues, or on levels of military armaments permitted after the war. Ukraine’s position during the negotiations necessitated security guarantees that western states were hesitant to provide. And there were domestic political questions inside Ukraine related to Russian demands about “denazification” to contend with.
So no, they hadnt agreed to revert to the feb-22 borders, that was still a matter of contension, and Russia were pushing for Ukrainian disarmament post war (i.e. surrender).
My dispute wasnt that there were attempts at negotiation, obviously there were; Macron in particular made a big show of pushing for them. But the idea that Russia ever offered status-quo ante-bellum (as they suggested) is ridiculous.
Correct, but I’m also going to lean on the side of Cablemonster either mis-remembering the facts, or mis-understanding the facts, rather than mis-representing the facts.
The Guardian article I found is presented as a fact check, so the idea that Boris Johnson killed a peace deal is clearly something that’s been floating around in the zeigeist.
Fair enough, personaly I find it hard to give the benefit of the doubt to people from that instance when it comes to topics like this.
You want me to look it up just so you can say “THATS A TERRIBLE SOURCE!!!”. I am going to pass.
So pulled out your arse then, gottcha.
If world wide news is considered my arse, then sure thing bro.
I mean, if it was world wide news surely it would be easy to get a reputable source like AP reporting that Russia officially made that offer?
Remember Chamberlain? He made his allies submit to german concessions because that would maintain peace. Fast forward five years and we had 40+ million more dead Europeans and the continent bombed to rubble.
Is every war WW2 for you guys? Do you know the non-propaganda reason this war started?
Russian expansionism.
Thats the propaganda version. Why did russia invade Georgia? (Hint: its the same reason they invaded Ukraine)
Yeah, that’s what I said, russian expansionism.
The peace deal where Ukraine gives up its territory.
not even peace deal, that was ceasefire. when all that was given up only then russians wanted to negotiate peace deal
And then Moldova, and then Lithuania, and then Northern Finland, and then I pinky promise peace.
I’m not saying I agree, the Russian or GOP troll above is trying to shift the narrative to Ukraine bad, somehow.
And I was agreeing with you bud. My point is that as long as we concede, there will always be further concessions required along the road if we want “peace”.
The guys at the Kremlin are bullies, we should already have learned our lesson.
Sorry wasn’t intending to be a dick. I don’t even remember what I wrote.
Hope you are having a good week!
The ones where Ukraine agrees to defund its military completely and stop asking for aid and Russia paints a little smiley face on their bombs in order to seem more friendly of course!
That guy’s a useful idiot, look at his history.
useful idiot
Great show; I made communities for the hosts!
You reminded me to share a video, thanks!
Useful Idiots is an informative and irreverent politics podcast with journalists @aaronjmate and @kthalps
This sounds like something stupid Joe Rogan would say lol
Do you watch Joe Rogan directly or do you just watch people that talk about him and tell you what to think about him?
The guy got famous making people eat blended rats. I don’t need to listen to his podcast to know I don’t give a shit what he has to say.
A hearty diet on bended rats made me who I am today, so I do not recommend it.
But what if I told you he sold brain supplements to make his listeners smart?
Dear god you are tiresome
You do know “You agree to stop protecting yourself and I’ll consider potentially maybe not bombing your orphanages and hospitals nearly as often, possibly.” is not a Respectable Peace Deal
Oh yeah, the one that goes “cut my land into pieces, for oligarchs’ resorts”
As a European I’m so gratefull people didn’t “go for talks” on that day they stormed the beaches… sometimes you have to actually fight for your ideals and not water them down every time they are opposed…
HERE COME THE FUCKING TANKIES
Tankies hate JD Vance too. The only reason he wants peace in Ukraine is to start shit with China. We tankies don’t want to make peace in one place just to fight somewhere else, we want peace and deescalation all over the globe.
…which is basically enabling imperialism.
It’s wild how eager people are to look at the exact same people who lied us into Iraq and Afghanistan and say, “Yeah, I trust them to have the people’s best interests at heart when they lead us into another conflict.”
Not everybody on Lemmy is American and bound to American news. Some of us live near russia and know first-hand about what it is and what it isn’t.
I know, you americans are really good at “doing your own research”.
Not everyone who went into Iraq or Afghanistan was an American either, the leaders of plenty of other countries supported it too.
Also we’re talking about American politician JD Vance and what he wants to do regarding US foreign policy, so the history of US foreign policy is obviously relevant.
I’m not talking about JD Vance. I’m talking about very convenient to tankies and ruskies “we want peace and deescalation” when Ukraine is devoured by an imperialist, authoritarian shithead.
But again, you’re a self-proclaimed tankie, of course your gobbling authoritarian dick.
Can’t think of a time in history where both sides in a war didn’t claim it was about defense and security, whether it was or not. I remember when they said “Either we fight them over there or we’ll have to fight them here,” and went off to kill a million people in the Middle East, and then they lost, and now, where are all the terror attacks they said would happen? I remember too (though I’m not old enough to have lived through it) when they said if we didn’t go out and kill 4 million people in Vietnam, they’d keep expanding all over and eventually we’d be fighting them here. Well, we lost that one too, and nothing bad happened afterward. So forgive me if I’m just a little bit skeptical of the latest pretext for pouring ridiculous sums of money into the pockets of defense contractors so the rich can get richer while our schools, roads, and hospitals decline further and further into dysfunction.
I am a tankie, yes, because tankies seem to be the only people interested in spending less money on tanks and more on human wellbeing.
Okay that’s cool, what about Iran, Russia, China, and North Korea, out there starting shit with everyone?
If you just give them what they want, they go away. Simples 🤦
Appeasement. 60% of the time it works every time.
Without tankies this place wouldnt exist, so yea we are gonna be here
It must be hard for the Tankies that developed Lemmy that most users dislike their communities.
It’s a shame that a regressive and thoughtless fringe ideology is attached to the project.
But make no mistake, Tankies didn’t invent federated social media or ActivityPub, they wrote a single piece of software. If it wasn’t Lemmy, it would be Kbin or some other project.
If the Tankies keep it up, they might find their software doesn’t get much funding or community attention, so there’s no reason to convince yourself that this place will continue to exist as a Lemmy-centric network.
Lol this passive aggressive nonsense is the most american thing in this thread. If you people dont stop having your own opinion, us white folk might just stop funding your little projects! How big and important you are, we definitely wouldnt want to offend you.
I’m not going to be passive aggressive about it, there’s a simple reality at play here.
Lemmy is FOSS, so the moment that these tankies try to give themselves some backdoor or whatever to gain undue influence over the system, it will be discovered, forked and everyone will switch and they will be left out in the cold with nothing.
Maybe that’ll happen, maybe it won’t. Maybe they’ll get sick of only running pariah instances and take their ball and go home, except we can make a copy of their ball and keep going.
That’s why I’m happy to use the system, it’s an open ecosystem and no individual developer has the power to torpedo it, even if they are the founders. Their authoritarian tendencies can’t do that much damage in the long run.
I was more talking about how you made it sound like the founders of lemmy are upset with the user base of it as a whole, and then said they are fake founders anyways because the real work was done before them by others, and then said if they keep it up (never said what they were doing to begin with) SOME PEOPLE wink**wink will stop supporting them financially.
Its just dripping with self importance and arrogance. Its an extremely american thing to assume that your viewpoint is the only valid and logical one.
You have me confused with someone else.
How very like a tankie to be unable to follow the basic and obvious facts of a situation. That’s necessary to become a tankie.
Yeah I assumed the person defending the OP was the OP, my bad. What’s your excuse for being an asshat? Internet tough guy? You sound so big and in charge when you talk like that you know. Do you talk to strangers like that in person too? Can you share your other qualities so I can copy them? You are obviously an amazing person so please help me.
Without fascism you would not exist either.
The US should abolish their entire military and roll back the military industrial complex.
And you should just give up your home to everyone that wants it.
The Americans are the ones who destroyed my home. There are over a million dead people in the middle east in the wake of the Americans taking our homes to bolster your oligarchy.
Can you tell me the country? I want to educate myself.
I am from Iran. The US overthrew the democracy there when my parents were kids and installed a King which ruled with an iron fist and a secret police called Saavik that terrorized the population which wasn’t part of the kings inner circle. The terror was so bad the country had a revolution and elected in an Islamic fundamentalist government. This is when my family had to scatter to the surrounding countries including Iraq, Afghanistan and Northern India. Over the next 30 years the Americans proceeded to destroy two of three of those countries for no reason. My Afghani family hasn’t been heard from in a decade. They’re dead.
By the way the US created modern Islamic Fundamentalism in order to fight the “godless” Soviet Union by funding the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and bankrolling the Wahabis in Saudi Arabia. They created the shock troops that became Al Qaeda. Later, using their own blowback and operatives as a cover they went in and collapsed the coalition that was formerly allied with them in Afghanistan, killing hundreds of thousands while allowing Al Qaeda to operate with impunity on the Afghani’s western border - Xinjiang, this benefits the Americans because they radicalized Ugyhers and provoked a Chinese response and now use this as part of their human rights based evidence free propaganda. Not satisfied with doing enough damage in Afghanistan they invaded Iraq with NATO under false pretenses and took what was once a first world nation that had the highest per capita amount of college graduates and doctors and turned it into a failed state. Hundreds of thousands of people died in that war. More have since starved.
These two nations surround my home country, which I am not allowed to return to because of the political machinations of the American oligarchy and their diplomatic failure to normalize and maintain peaceful relationships with anyone, and complete inability to keep a promise (This is typical of Americans, just ask the indigenous people there) and have caused the inflamed local conflicts with Hezbollah and other regional actors that perpetually keep the American resource extraction region precarious and violent.
The world sucks because the US empire profits from war. It is a weapons and military industrial complex that exists only to destroy.
Wasn’t USA siding with Phalavi against Khomeini?
I think you might have to point into another direction in that case.
Did you read the comment at all?
The US overthrew the democracy there when my parents were kids and installed a King which ruled with an iron fist and a secret police called Saavik that terrorized the population which wasn’t part of the kings inner circle. The terror was so bad the country had a revolution and elected in an Islamic fundamentalist government.
Yes, the US backed Pavlavi, they’re the ones that gave him power over the more democratic system they had before. He hunted people (primarily leftists) down with secret police and ran the country terribly, as the resource colony it was, to the point that the conditions were created for a revolution, and since most of the leftists had been killed, the fundamentalists were able to take advantage of the situation.
I don’t think I should even reply to this pile of disinformation.
It is Phalavi’s fault that Khomeni came to power. Phalavi ran Saavik. He is an evil mother fucker and the US backing them make them evil mother fuckers
I agree with a lot of what you said, but the US inventing Islamic fundamentalism is a comical take.
Abrahamic extremists have been useful idiots of those in power for thousands of years. The US is just the latest to take advantage.
The real problem there is religion is poison
It is comical to you because you are ignorant of history, your analysis of religion and global power is a child’s take.
@mriormro@lemmy.world I’m honored this comment made you look at my profile and downvote multiple comments, coward
Putins favorite, JD Vance.
I thought the maggots wanted to leave NATO.
They do, but they also don’t want other people in it, either.
Wait why isn’t Mike pence vp? Am I OOTL?
Umm, very. Look up “hang Mike Pence”
The article says he supported Biden winning. Oh noooooo a fair and equal election, no wayyy
Oh no, the guy said no to Trump refusing to break the law during the January 6th “oopsie treason failed uprising” so he burned that bridge.
Can’t have people blatantly respecting democracy and the rule of law, that’s not how the possible future felon-in-chief rolls. (But yet somehow it’s the democrats inciting violence against him, hum.)
