Except that the slave owners were fine after the civil war. There were no mass executions, they got to keep their property (slaves excepted) and they retained so much political power they managed to reverse reconstruction within a few decades.
There’s no reason you couldn’t dissolve the apartheid state without the violence Zionists claim would be wrought on them. South Africa can be a model for this.
Civil War was a country fighting itself for a few years. Israel and Palestine have been at odds for… Ever. There’s a little more animosity than the civil war. Also dissolving the apartheid state is anathema to Israel because they don’t want to share the land.
Israel and Palestine haven’t been at odds forever, they were at odds since WW1. There were long periods in time where people lived peacefully. There were religious tolerance laws going back to like 600AD. Christian pilgrims going there en masse. Treaties between Crusaders and Egypt allowing for religious freedoms. Almost 500 years of Ottoman rule, where anyone could practice any religion if they paid a tax. Communities had autonomy and could govern themselves according to their own laws - be it Christian, Jewish or Muslim. Said tax also exempt you from military service and was “proof” of allegiance to the state. Women, children, elders didn’t have to pay the tax at all. There were exceptions for basically anyone who couldn’t pay it - handicapped people for instance. If you were allowed to join the army, then when you did, the tax was waived with all the benefits still being given to you. Hell, some even were exempt for being too poor to pay it. The tax was cirqa 10 days of expenses of an average family. The richer you were, the tax went higher.
You also need to remember, that the population of Palestine was like 200k, with all the now huge cities having maybe 5k people in them in the 15th hundreds. 700k people in the early 20th century, when the Brits pulled a switcharoo and established a Jewish state. Any animosity from the past was long gone. The issues are because Jewish people were being resettled into Palestine in alarming numbers. Also, the literal decimation of palestinian population by the brits in 39’. Also the 700k people displaced in the Nakba. Also the further 400k displaced later. The genocide was happening in the 20th century. With people earlier living in a relatively free society. The formation of the state of Israel began with countries basically throwing a “hot potato” to Palestine, by genociding their own Jewish populations by sending them to Palestine. A one state solution was within reach, but it’s hard to do if you just draw straight lines on the map and call it a day.
As for the current day - Germany was the most horrific country during WW2 with countless warcrimes and mass killings, genocide of a few different cultures / countries, and the Holocaust. Now, after the war, Germany was welcomed back into Europe, rebuilt and is playing the first fiddle in the European Union, alongside France (and until recently the UK). If that can happen after Prussia, two World Wars, after Hitler, after the Holocaust, then a peace in Palestine is 100% possible.
What needs to happen is someone needs to kick Netanyahu in the balls really really hard. The government of Israel needs to change. The United States needs to stop its unconditional support of Israel - instead basing it on Israel and Palestine staying peaceful. And with time, wounds will heal. People will marry one another. Communities will blend together. And even if a single state solution is probably off the table in any way, shape or form, for at least a century, a two state solution is feasible.
The issue is, the US doesn’t need a peaceful Middle East. They need the “unsinkable aircraft carrier”. The US government doesn’t care that Palestine is disappearing and Israel is taking over. They might care that they antagonize Iran by bombing Iran. But at the end of the day, it’s just a statistic and “single issue vote” to many people, instead of the horrific reality. So until US voters see peace in the Middle East as an important issue, the genocide will continue.
Except the North didn’t want mass executions and was willing to let the South keep their institutions.
I can assure you, Israel’s neighbors would be more than happy to burn it to the ground. So while you could dissolve the Zionist state, you would have to do so while still supporting the defense of Israel, or else you’d just switch from a massacre of Palestinians to a massacre of Jews.
The ANC made a special point to protect the apartheidists during their Truth and Reconciliation hearings. It wasn’t until said white farmers began violently resisting efforts to repatriate land to native farmers that the government lost control of retribution. Even then, they weren’t “slaughtered”. Many simply abandoned the properties after the ANC failed to intercede on their behalf.
From a former Pentecostal pastor to entire families, a growing number of Afrikaners are converting to Orthodox Judaism and swapping South Africa for Israel – and, in many cases, West Bank settlements
All of them? I’m pretty sure there’s still a lot of white south Africans around, just because there were a few incidents doesn’t make it largely peaceful. The alternative to a peaceful transition is Rhodesia, if you want to go the route of constant escalation.
If my family owned slaves they could go fuck themselves. Sorry to hear family is more important to you than not supporting horrifying amounts of racism, I hope they’re not voting for trump
I don’t even care if I get banned from this community for saying this: I hope to your (imaginary) god that you die a horrifying and public death. Ideally sooner rather than later. You, and everyone who thinks like you, are directly responsible for SO MUCH of the evil in this world.
You might be in denial over this, but had you lived in Nazi Germany, statistically you would have been a nazi. A concentration camp guard even.
“The line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either – but right through every human heart – and through all human hearts. This line shifts. Inside us, it oscillates with the years. And even within hearts overwhelmed by evil, one small bridgehead of good is retained.”
Almost self aware.
If being right means death for your family, it is rational to be wrong.
If being right means death for your family, it is rational to be wrong.
Except that the slave owners were fine after the civil war. There were no mass executions, they got to keep their property (slaves excepted) and they retained so much political power they managed to reverse reconstruction within a few decades.
There’s no reason you couldn’t dissolve the apartheid state without the violence Zionists claim would be wrought on them. South Africa can be a model for this.
Civil War was a country fighting itself for a few years. Israel and Palestine have been at odds for… Ever. There’s a little more animosity than the civil war. Also dissolving the apartheid state is anathema to Israel because they don’t want to share the land.
Israel and Palestine haven’t been at odds forever, they were at odds since WW1. There were long periods in time where people lived peacefully. There were religious tolerance laws going back to like 600AD. Christian pilgrims going there en masse. Treaties between Crusaders and Egypt allowing for religious freedoms. Almost 500 years of Ottoman rule, where anyone could practice any religion if they paid a tax. Communities had autonomy and could govern themselves according to their own laws - be it Christian, Jewish or Muslim. Said tax also exempt you from military service and was “proof” of allegiance to the state. Women, children, elders didn’t have to pay the tax at all. There were exceptions for basically anyone who couldn’t pay it - handicapped people for instance. If you were allowed to join the army, then when you did, the tax was waived with all the benefits still being given to you. Hell, some even were exempt for being too poor to pay it. The tax was cirqa 10 days of expenses of an average family. The richer you were, the tax went higher.
You also need to remember, that the population of Palestine was like 200k, with all the now huge cities having maybe 5k people in them in the 15th hundreds. 700k people in the early 20th century, when the Brits pulled a switcharoo and established a Jewish state. Any animosity from the past was long gone. The issues are because Jewish people were being resettled into Palestine in alarming numbers. Also, the literal decimation of palestinian population by the brits in 39’. Also the 700k people displaced in the Nakba. Also the further 400k displaced later. The genocide was happening in the 20th century. With people earlier living in a relatively free society. The formation of the state of Israel began with countries basically throwing a “hot potato” to Palestine, by genociding their own Jewish populations by sending them to Palestine. A one state solution was within reach, but it’s hard to do if you just draw straight lines on the map and call it a day.
As for the current day - Germany was the most horrific country during WW2 with countless warcrimes and mass killings, genocide of a few different cultures / countries, and the Holocaust. Now, after the war, Germany was welcomed back into Europe, rebuilt and is playing the first fiddle in the European Union, alongside France (and until recently the UK). If that can happen after Prussia, two World Wars, after Hitler, after the Holocaust, then a peace in Palestine is 100% possible.
What needs to happen is someone needs to kick Netanyahu in the balls really really hard. The government of Israel needs to change. The United States needs to stop its unconditional support of Israel - instead basing it on Israel and Palestine staying peaceful. And with time, wounds will heal. People will marry one another. Communities will blend together. And even if a single state solution is probably off the table in any way, shape or form, for at least a century, a two state solution is feasible.
The issue is, the US doesn’t need a peaceful Middle East. They need the “unsinkable aircraft carrier”. The US government doesn’t care that Palestine is disappearing and Israel is taking over. They might care that they antagonize Iran by bombing Iran. But at the end of the day, it’s just a statistic and “single issue vote” to many people, instead of the horrific reality. So until US voters see peace in the Middle East as an important issue, the genocide will continue.
… If we had been more rough on the slave owners America would be a far better place.
No statues to hitler and goering in Germany.
Except the North didn’t want mass executions and was willing to let the South keep their institutions.
I can assure you, Israel’s neighbors would be more than happy to burn it to the ground. So while you could dissolve the Zionist state, you would have to do so while still supporting the defense of Israel, or else you’d just switch from a massacre of Palestinians to a massacre of Jews.
So what you are saying, Israel neighbours would be happy to do with Israel the same Israel do to Gaza?
Is it an argument against? So we should have saved Nazis in the 2WW, yes?
Except white farmers were slaughtered in south africa…
The ANC made a special point to protect the apartheidists during their Truth and Reconciliation hearings. It wasn’t until said white farmers began violently resisting efforts to repatriate land to native farmers that the government lost control of retribution. Even then, they weren’t “slaughtered”. Many simply abandoned the properties after the ANC failed to intercede on their behalf.
Quite a few white South Africans are currently leaving to become converts to Judaism in order to participate in the Israeli Settler Movement
All of them? I’m pretty sure there’s still a lot of white south Africans around, just because there were a few incidents doesn’t make it largely peaceful. The alternative to a peaceful transition is Rhodesia, if you want to go the route of constant escalation.
That’s the same self serving BS excuse we heard from slave owners during the civil war, and from Afrikaners during apartheid.
You are delusional if you think you would have done any differently if you had been in their position.
If my family owned slaves they could go fuck themselves. Sorry to hear family is more important to you than not supporting horrifying amounts of racism, I hope they’re not voting for trump
I don’t even care if I get banned from this community for saying this: I hope to your (imaginary) god that you die a horrifying and public death. Ideally sooner rather than later. You, and everyone who thinks like you, are directly responsible for SO MUCH of the evil in this world.
I FUCKING HATE YOU, and everything you stand for.
You might be in denial over this, but had you lived in Nazi Germany, statistically you would have been a nazi. A concentration camp guard even.
“The line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either – but right through every human heart – and through all human hearts. This line shifts. Inside us, it oscillates with the years. And even within hearts overwhelmed by evil, one small bridgehead of good is retained.”
Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
If my family are genocidal cunts, they get the least dramatic ending that stops their bullshit, and not one bit less.