I have been trying to get my partner into Pathfinder 2nd edition, and they do seem taken with it, however he’s been having some issues lately with PF2E. Notably, online. The more he gets into PF2E, the more hate he sees for 5E. He’s been playing 5E for years now and has invested a lot of time and love into the game, and to see it bad-mouthed online by a ton of people either because they think PF2E is better, or they don’t like the system, or because of the company that manages it, has been disheartening to him as of late.
He told me today that he might just stop playing altogether after he’s finished with his games because of the hate he’s been seeing online, and I would hate for him to drop something he loves and has invested so much time into because of some online hate comments coming from another community in an act of internet tribalism.
I tried telling him that people disliked D&D4E when it came out for various reasons, yet people still play it today, and that when I started playing 5E, 4E had the reputation of being the game that everyone hates, but he’s still focused on how people will bad-mouth 5E when they really have no need to. One example I can remember him seeing (and before I bring it up, I understand Reddit’s culture, but the large amount of forum posts are going to be on Reddit, especially for a large and insular hobby like TTRPGs) was on a Reddit thread of someone asking what an analogous spell or ability would be to some spell in 5E and one person commented something to the effect of “well, you could try using this spell/ability, but you won’t get the same effect as you would in 5E because 5E is just for auto-win stuff that doesn’t have the player trying hard” (moderately paraphrasing, but I think my point is conveyed well here).
Personally, I like PF2E over 5E, but I’ll still play both, mostly because most people will play 5E and not want to try and learn a new system, especially if it’s one that has a reputation of having exponentially more rules than the one they already know and are comfortable with. Does anyone have any tips for how I can help my partner here?
I think the main issue with 5E is that it’s so dominant and well-known people have been trying to make 5E into the game they want rather than seek a system more similar to their desires. 5E can be difficult, but at the many tables I’ve played at it’s almost guaranteed every party member will survive almost everything to preserve the narrative. It’s a system as forgiving as the table wants, and the table usually wants it to be forgiving.
It’s easy for one person to learn an entire system, but it’s easier for a DM to find players who already know 5E than to find a group of people willing to learn a new system. It can make people feel trapped by 5E.
Personally, I love the system but hate what Hasbro has done to the RPG community. While I’ll still probably play 5E since I’ve already had it for years, any purchase I make in the future will be from a third party or from a different publisher.
That’s fair, and I personally like PF2E better than 5E. After having GM’ed PF2E for about a year to a year and a half (this was from about 2021 to about 2022), I don’t feel like I could DM 5E again because it puts so much pressure on the DM to work (rulings over rules) and while some are okay with that, I personally don’t like it.