Fairly universally the worst moment (Mine was actually validating, but ppl seem to hate it)
This might take several minutes
…or itcould take several hours
It says “several” but I think it means “many”, important distinction to make there Microsoft.
Then failed half way through, and needed another hour to “reverse changes”.
“If you play your cards right and allow recall ;)”
or itcould take several hours
only if you have a shitty computer full of garbage. My windows updates only take 2 minutes or less. even feature updates only take about 4 minutes to reboot.
Windows is only shitty if you don’t know how to use it. Just because you know what the buttons do doesn’t mean you know how to use it.
How does that “garbage” affect update time?
if your computer is full of crap it will be slow.
or it could take several hours
Would give you enough time to get your mouse drivers working on Linux then
What’s mouse drivers, precious?
They have tiny tiny cars sweetheart
Bullshit, paid Windows shill. Even a brand new, high end PC on a fast internet with a fresh (non-OEM full of crap) install of Windows takes LITERALLY SEVERAL HOURS to fully update and often even minor updates will take at least an hour depending on what’s being updated.
Don’t give me that shit. You know it’s a lie. Windows is trash.
Trigger warning! Updating my linux systems takes 15 seconds ;)
It depends how out of date you are.
Absolutely, but unless you’re on a rolling release, it still won’t be that long. For example, my homelab ubuntu server didn’t get updated for over a month, but when I finally did run updates it finished after no more than a minute. Depends a bit on hardware and network speed though.
It shouldn’t be an issue even on a rolling release. I mean it’s not like it installs every intermediary version of every package, it just jumps to the latest versions no? At least that’s how I imagine it works.
Right, but my tumbleweed install gets 100+ package updates per week, whereas ubuntu gets like 20
Yes. The question comes down to how many of these you need. And do you have the resources for it?
And you can postpone it to whenever you want, also post thesis defence.
You have to cut Microsoft some slack on mandatory updates. They’re still traumatized from the XP era when they were the platform of choice for botnets and “Windows security” was a laughing stock.
Tbh, if Linux had the same user base as windows had back then a large amount of people would postpone any update indefinitely and we’d be in the same shit.
True
Yeah it’s a different game when your user base is tech savvy and self-selecting. When you have to deal with a billion non-technical people you have to be a lot more protective.
But even so Linux seems miles ahead. It’s Microsoft who should be the most motivated to add things like AppArmor, Flatpak, immutable system, curated app repos, executable as a filesystem attribute etc. They’re doing none of that, they plateaued at UAC and bundling their own antivirus.
They tried. UWP and the Windows Store did loads to boost security and make the source of apps verifiable, but people hated it and barely used it, so the holes they were supposed to patch stayed open. The store itself did have the problem that part of its raison d’être was to try and take a cut of the sales of all software for Windows, like Apple do for iOS, and UWP made certain things a pain or impossible (sometimes because they were inherently insecure), but UWP wasn’t tied to the store and did improve even though it’s barely used.
executable as a filesystem attribute
This already exists. It’s labeled as “Traverse folder / execute file” in the UI.
NTFS permissions are also more powerful than the default Linux permission system. Instead of just being able to define permissions for a single user and single group, you can define them for an arbitrary number of users and groups.
I say “default Linux permission system” because you can actually use ACLs on Linux (
getfaclandsetfaclcommands), they’re just not used by default. They used to be common in businesses and schools, but these days everyone seems to store their files “in the cloud” and the permissions are managed there instead.curated app repos
This is what the Windows store is supposed to be. There’s also WinGet, but I’m not sure if it’s curated.
Troll successful lol
Good luck! You got this!
Its the final boss.
You need to fight the windows update!
It’s* the final boss.
dont bother correcting apostrophes as its not a grammatical mistake, simply lazy typing. well never stop doing that no matter how much yall tell us not to, cuz it simply aint all that much of a problem
The worst is when it’s actually its, the one time it’s their time to shine and the whole thing just flies over their heads. Smh my head
I saw that happen once in a big presentation.
There was a team of students presenting their work to ~200 people. Right in the middle, a pop-up says updates are finished and the computer needs to restart. It has a helpful 60-second countdown, but “cancel” is grayed out, so all they can do is watch.
I was only in the audience and I still have nightmares.
The super duper shitty thing is that they could have canceled it by opening the Run dialog box and typing “shutdown -a”, so it’s not even like canceling wasn’t an option. M$ just decided to be dicks about it
Maybe? If I recall correctly, this was Windows XP. Also the computer was owned by the school, so the students didn’t have admin access.
That screen didn’t exist in Win XP. If it had, it would have been a different shade of blue. This is either Win10 though I suspect it’s Win11.
The event I’m referring to wasn’t OP’s photo. Mine was back in 2004 or 2005, long before Win10 was released.
M$ just decided to be dicks about it
A most concise yet comprehensive company bio.
Is this a w11 thing? Or does o&o shutup in default settings disable stuff like that. I actually never have seen a forced reboot like that myself.
It sounds really shitty and i dislike windows alot.
It only happens if you neglect to install updates for a very long time, which is a pretty dumb thing to do. This is actually a non-issue if you just install the damn updates once they’re announced. Just update when shutting down. Also, using home edition is pretty dumb. With the pro version you’ll likely never run into this problem.
shutdown -acouldn’t help in that situation?Damn I forgot about that
They didn’t know, but yea.
I love these comments. If you need to use the command line (the largest argument people have against Linux) why are people still arguing to stay on Windows? Hell, Linux you don’t even need the terminal if you don’t want to use it and choose the right distro.
(I recognize that for schools and offices, people don’t have a choice. These students were probably on a personal laptop though, so they could have a choice. The issue is Windows comes as default and no one actually makes a choice. They don’t choose Windows. They just have Windows.)
Windows always gets a pass from it’s fans. They also tend to overestimate average users’ proficiency with computers (meaning windows) way more than linux users.
Most windows users would be afraid to change stuff on CP or Settings never mind opening up policy editor or registry editor.
They regularly fail to install applications on windows (a big part of them would probably not even try) or install something different than intended.
Usually they end up running million unnecessary things on startup, having completely unresponsive systems. They just shrug and cope with it till they pay someone to format their computer or they buy a new one.
The arrogance of some Linux users… You just can’t fathom that most people just want to use the OS their PC came with. These people don’t want to struggle with the incompatibilities that come with Linux systems. Troubleshooting Linux systems is a daunting task for most casual users. It’s great that you use Linux because fuck greedy corporations. But stop being so uppity about it. This toxic behavior is what steers people away from Linux forums.
You just can’t fathom that most people just want to use the OS their PC came with.
No they don’t they want to get a task done. The vast majority of users doesn’t know what an OS or a browser is never mind that there are alternatives.
These people don’t want to struggle with the incompatibilities that come with Linux systems.
Most people are simply not aware of Linux systems let alone linux system incompatibilities.
Troubleshooting Linux systems is a daunting task for most casual users.
No shit, troubleshooting windows is a daunting task for most casual users. They either nag/pay someone to try and fix it or simply cope with it. And windows fucks up all the time, especially for most users.
It’s great that you use Linux because fuck greedy corporations. But stop being so uppity about it. This toxic behavior is what steers people away from Linux forums.
People don’t just randomly get on Linux forums, especially linux memes forums. Nor is my previous comment in any way or form toxic. I just pointed out the blind spot of windows fans, you just can’t handle criticism.
For every 1 person who knows how to use the windows command line, there are 50 people struggling because they didn’t embed their video into their PowerPoint, or worse, their USB stick only contains a shortcut to their actual .ppt file
I mean, not to beat a dead horse but those are precisely the type of people who would push off an update forever if given the choice.
Not that a midday, mid work reboot is acceptable.
their USB stick only contains a shortcut to their actual .ppt file
This happened all the time when I was in middle school. Way to activate a suppressed memory.
Those kids are still wincing to this day
Then it proceeds to take 10 minutes to boot. Happened to me before an important meeting once and i just couldn’t believe it. wtf makes Microsoft think they can get away with shit like this?
Probably that they very obviously are!
Just blame the users. Easy.
Usually for large businesses like universities IT can choose when to push updates.
Some versions like Home and Education might lack the options, but most Enterprise versions and LTSC versions can let you delay updates via the menu or disable updates completely via group policy fuckery.
Still bullshit that they have to, though.
Shutdown -a or whatever the flag is should abort it if I remember correctly
Yeah -a for “abort” Still, an user shouldn’t have to know that
our work uses macs but also Kandji for software management, which also locks you into restarts during business hours 😎
They think they can get away with it because they keep getting away with it.
wtf makes Microsoft think they can get away with shit like this?
I’d wager a guess it’s people dumb enough to constantly put up with shit like this?
Combined with myopic developers who always have the newest hardware and fastest connection.
yeah, that’s another epic IT fail of humanity
Because the alternative is people getting compromised and getting their computer crypto locked, accounts stolen or their bank account drained.
Other OSes can update everything while running and you just reboot to the updated system. Microsoft could definitely fix their update process they are not incompetent, they just don’t care.
Good luck on your defense! Goodspeed
Should make that screen the first slide of the PowerPoint
One in the middle, including the pop-up notification about a pending restart before that. Hahaha nice
I’m going to do this now
I know what to do next time I’m teaching on 4/1…
Also do it on 4/20.
Windows disagrees with the thesis.
So did the rest of the committee.
Is this a joke, or did your friend really fail? Would be interested to know what happened, if you don’t mind sharing
Oof
the thesis was on why you should move to Linux
Have you tried turning it off and on aga… Oh nevermind. Carry on.
Much as I always feel Microsoft has made some horrible missteps around automatic updates…I also think many many users are vocally and unabashedly following horrible update policies.
The biggest one is “Fuck you, Microsoft, I don’t ever want to update.” A simple truth about Windows is that it is currently the most popular operating system in the world. If that OS was Unix-based, the resulting truth would still be true: The most popular OS is going to be the most common target for vulnerabilities, hacks, malware, and exploits. Far more than an antivirus, keeping that computer up to date is the most important step for keeping it secure.
This is true not just of computers used to manage your bank account and nuclear launch codes, but of the swarm of “convenience” computers sitting inside a campus network that could spread a virus to everything on the Wi-Fi.
So, looking at this image, it’s a shame on Microsoft moment if this update came from nowhere, or they once again blatantly ignored the configured update time. It’s a shame on the campus moment if someone was repeatedly closing the “Time to update” popup.
In addition to what was said by somebody else about atomic updates, even a simple update via package manager on a regular distro will do all the work up front, and not take extra time on next boot. Before you reboot, most things will continue working fine - and most of the remaining things that might not can be worked around.
Other systems like ChromeOS and Silverblue do atomic updates in the background and then switch on next restart. No waiting at screens like this. Heck even the conventional Linux update system, while far from foolproof, doesn’t require waiting like this.
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So does windows for the most part
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Do you know how often users actually restart their machines without being forced?
Do you know how often users actually restart their machines without being forced?
If Windows would actually shut the fuck down when asked to do so, this wouldn’t be a problem.
I complained enough at my work about this that we shut off fast boot domain wide. I haven’t had to have a “I know that you just turned your computer on but I need you to restart it. No, not shutdown and turn on, restart. Yes, they are different things.” conversation in a couple years. Funnily enough I haven’t seen anyone complain about the significantly longer start up times. I guess people just expect that from windows lol.
I think people just don’t care about startup times. They do it maybe once per day (if they don’t sleep and resume), and they probably get a coffee or something while it’s starting up.
Walk in, press on button, hang up jacket and get stuff out of bag, type in password, grab coffee.
That’s a pretty common morning pattern I see.
No Windows doesn’t do atomic updates in the background, that’s why there is the whole installing updates screen on reboot or shutdown.
Yes it does? As far as I’m aware even Linux can’t apply updates to an active system.
You vastly misunderstand both what I am talking about, and how updates work on both Windows and Linux.
You don’t press shut down and then get a blue updating screen that stops you from doing anything on Linux. Go and update a Linux system and you will see what I am talking about. You run it just like a normal command or program.
Also yes they update the files on the drive while the system is running.
Fairly often if it wasn’t for the whole fast startup thing, which isn’t present in Linux land. I would say at least every couple of weeks, which is good enough for updates.
Perhaps the solution is to figure out how to update without restarting. It is a hard problem, but a forced restart is the same as a crash from a user perspective.
Imagine if they replaced the crash screen with a fake automatic update.
That’s some oblivion on xbox shit right there. Hide a restart with a loading screen.
Years ago there was a screensaver that showed a fake “upgrading to Vista, please wait” screen. Just wait for someone to leave their computer unattended, download and set it as the screensaver, and wait for their reaction when they’re back :)
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The issue is some updates don’t contain just security fixes, but rather privacy invading features and advertising that make the OS shittier.
Oh, no argument from me on that. And it’s horrible that Microsoft is starting to make people choose between having a secure system and avoiding their adware bullshit.
My favorite windows update was when I was attending an onsite coding competition hosted my Microsoft. We were all in this large meeting hall that looked like a theater, and we spent first 10 minutes or so at the start of the competition just looking at Windows update, with the Microsoft rep apologizing to us, because his pc decided to do the “Forced update restart you cant postpone any more” literally two minutes into the presentation
When your dog food tastes like dog food
As a presenter would be mortified.
As an attendee, hilarious.
As an attendee, would be somewhat annoyed
As someone on the Internet, hilarious
That’s probably the presenter’s fault for not updating it earlier. Keep on top of your updates so they don’t force you to do it at an unfortunate time.
Well, aside from this I hope it all went well OP!
That’s the least of your worries. Once it reboots, its proprietary spyware…errr…AI…will resume taking screenshots of everything you do.
