Misinformation campaigns increasingly target the cavity-fighting mineral, prompting communities to reverse mandates. Dentists are enraged. Parents are caught in the middle.
The culture wars have a new target: your teeth.
Communities across the U.S. are ending public water fluoridation programs, often spurred by groups that insist that people should decide whether they want the mineral — long proven to fight cavities — added to their water supplies.
The push to flush it from water systems seems to be increasingly fueled by pandemic-related mistrust of government oversteps and misleading claims, experts say, that fluoride is harmful.
“The anti-fluoridation movement gained steam with Covid,” said Dr. Meg Lochary, a pediatric dentist in Union County, North Carolina. “We’ve seen an increase of people who either don’t want fluoride or are skeptical about it.”
There should be no question about the dental benefits of fluoride, Lochary and other experts say. Major public health groups, including the American Dental Association, the American Academy of Pediatrics and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, support the use of fluoridated water. All cite studies that show it reduces tooth decay by 25%.
“Medical freedom”, the rallying cry for all kinds of grifters spreading disinformation and wanting to roll back the progress made in public health.
🥱
Or, give people the option to choose for themselves.
Scientific consensus has been wrong many times before, and it will be wrong many times again.
I’m struggling with this.
You’re saying that because science was wrong about something else, it must be wrong about fluoride?
I think that if you really dig into it, you’ll find that arsenic use wasn’t supported by science, but rather snake oil salesmen.
it must be wrong about fluoride?
This is where your confusion comes from. I never said it’s wrong about fluoride.
My point is that unless you understand the science yourself, you have faith in other people who do. Scientific consensus has been wrong in the past, and it will be wrong again in the future.
Everyone saying with such certainty that fluoride is good or bad without understanding the science themselves just highlights how most people treat science like a religion.
most people treat science like a religion.
That’s just not true. By it’s very nature, what we describe as “science” is reproducible. That means faith is not required.
If you understand the science yourself, then you’re correct.
The problem is that most people don’t understand the science and just have faith in other people who might.
No, my point is that because “science” is reproducible, you do not need faith in the people producing said science, nor do you need to understand it.
You merely need to confirm that it has been reviewed and accepted by other people who do understand it.
Have faith.
You do have the option to choose for yourself.
You can not only choose to filter it out, you can choose which filter you want to purchase from a selection. Here you go. https://apexwaterfilters.com/blogs/top-5-water-filters-to-remove-fluoride-from-water/
Right.
Let’s put any amount of contaminates in our drinking water just so people can “filter them out.”
Someone mentioned arsenic earlier in this thread, and I think I can find some study that says arsenic is good for you. Let’s add it to our water and anyone who thinks it’s harmful can just filter it out.
Go away.
Fluoride is not a contaminant, but please do find a study that says arsenic is good for you. This should be interesting.
Fluoride is not a contaminant
Says who?
https://gizmodo.com/hey-remember-when-people-used-to-eat-arsenic-as-a-heal-1676316276
It’s not a study, but there was a time when people believed arsenic wasn’t poisonous. There were most likely scientists back in the day advocating for its usage. You can find their work if you’re really interested.
A more recent and easier to research example would be all the “studies” saying lead is safe. Do I have to specifically point to those, or can you understand my point without it?
It’s not a study
Okay, so note what you claimed.
There were most likely scientists back in the day advocating for its usage. You can find their work if you’re really interested.
It’s not my job to prove you aren’t lying.
I mean, if you don’t want to understand then you won’t understand.
I’ve done my part. If you want to replace arsenic with lead, then will it make sense?
Probably not because you don’t want to understand.
Also,
Fluoride is not a contaminant
Says who?
You conveniently ignored this part.
medical freedom for me, but not for thee who want no more penis.
And they don’t seem to like the fact that they have the freedom to filter the fluoride back out of the water.
…what?
AND THEY DON’T SEEM TO LIKE THE FACT THAT THEY HAVE THE FREEDOM TO FILTER THE FLUORIDE BACK OUT OF THE WATER.
fluoride is not easy to filter - its smaller than water molecules.
Right.
Let’s put any amount of contaminates in our drinking water just so people can “filter them out.”
I swear, some of you people are just too far gone.
“Contaminants” 🙄
Again, there are places where fluoride occurs naturally in drinking water at higher concentrations than it is added artificially and there don’t seem to be significant health problems.
Hmmmmm no ! I’m not against fluoride in water, I don’t care since I don’t live in north america but spreading disinformation does not help.
There is regions, especially in India, where fluoride occurs by naturally in water in high concentration which is causing multiple serious health issues.
“There are higher concentrations of fluoride in water than we usually put in it that is still healthy to drink” != “Any concentration of fluoride in water is safe”
Any substance becomes toxic if you ingest too much of it. If you exceed by a factor of 20 the amount of plenty of things people usually consume, it isn’t difficult to find things that are dangerous or even lethal. Say, coffee, beer, anti-inflammatories, chocolate, Coke.
Cool. I said higher concentrations that are added artificially, not extremely high concentration.
The fluoride in your tap water is not a contaminant.
Nobody said dump contaminants in the water supply.
If you don’t have something meaningful to contribute then stop spread fear and misinformation over something that is perfectly healthy to consume in the quantities we currently do.
What’s next? Are you going to start whining about the iron content of your meat? The calcium in dairy?
The fluoride in your tap water is not a contaminant.
Says who?
Says accountable organizations that you’ll never trust because you put ideology above discretion and good judgment.
There is no number of groups I can rattle off to satisfy you. You have already made up your mind based on what I can only assume is bunk science and braindead YouTube channels if you’ve actually managed to base it off of anything.
Yes, the World Heath Organization (WHO) does say it is not a contaminent and that appropriate levels are needed.
Literally every person who understands science and water treatment
Except fluoride isn’t a contaminate.
According to what?
Every single scientific study regarding the use of fluoride in drinking water to help protect oral health. Link me a scientific study that proves flouride in drinking water is harmful.
So we’ve circled back to to water/fluoride water conspiracies again?
History, doomed to repeat, before our very eyes once more…
Can always rely on the classics to stir up the rubes. A new sucker born every minute.
No, but not for any health reasons, it just tastes like shit lol
I absolutely can’t stand minty or cinnamon toothpaste, and have really struggled with brushing my teeth because of it. It drives me absolutely insane that so many of the flavors I can tolerate are only available in fluoride free formulations and/or get discontinued.
Crest two in one shield is strawberry flavor with fluoride. Source: I have a teen with the same aversion. It doesn’t have animals or anything on it, but it is a “kids” toothpaste. You’d never know without reading it though, so I thought I’d mention it. Sorry if you’ve already heard of that one.
I haven’t tried it, but will keep it in mind. I’m currently using the Hello brand toothpastes. They seem to be a little less sweet than most other kids toothpastes, which is a big plus for me. I like their bubblegum and orange flavors best, and the blue raspberry isn’t bad either. They have some other flavors without fluoride, so you have to pay attention though.
Orange? I’m going to have to try that one, that actually sounds amazing.
Yeah, Crest used to sell an orange flavored toothpaste that wasn’t a kid’s product, and when it got discontinued, I paid about $30 for 3 tubes, so I was super excited to find another orange toothpaste. The only challenge is that very few stores carry the orange one, so I think I ended up buying it directly from the manufacturer website.
Oh man I don’t remember the orange toothpaste, but I remember when Crest had the orange mouthwash bc that was my jam.
I have issues with brushing too. I have a nerve disorder in my face which makes brushing my teeth extremely painful, so I can’t do it all that often. I definitely benefit from fluoridated drinking water.
For some reason, I don’t believe you.
There’s no way drinking fluoridated water comes anywhere close to offering the protection that brushing does.
You must get a lot of cavities and have receding gums, or you brush more often than you’re letting on.
So, I do brush my teeth at least daily (I shoot for twice, but I’m not going to pretend that always happens), and I’ve recently started flossing once daily (recently as in, it was my New Years resolution).
I’ve only had cavities twice in my life - once when I spent 2 years living in Okinawa, and once when I got back from a deployment where we were advised to only drink bottled water.
No other adjustments to my routine. The only thing I can chalk it up to is the lack of fluoride in both instances. And like I said, I’m not someone who takes immaculate care of my teeth.
Edit: Purely anecdotal experience, obviously, I just really couldn’t come up with an alternative answer 🤷♀️
I never said my teeth were perfect, I said I get a benefit.
I mean, if you still get cavities and gum disease then what benefit are you really getting?
Fewer cavities and less gum disease. I’m not sure why you don’t consider making something less of a health problem to be beneficial.
It’s just… I’m dubious that it’s even less of a problem. Have you seen what happens when you don’t drink fluoridated water?
You just seem to have poor dental health because you don’t take care of your teeth properly.
Be as dubious as you like.
You just seem to have poor dental health
I never said that, you did.
you don’t take care of your teeth properly.
Yes, I explained why.
You seem to be a very nosey person with strange opinions. Seems like you can easily do something about it, while Flying Squid can’t. Maybe take this opportunity?
It’s just… I’m dubious that it’s even less of a problem. Have you seen what happens when you don’t drink fluoridated water? You just seem to have poor dental health because you don’t take care of your teeth properly.
How is this “ableism/trolling”?
Ouch, that must really suck! I’m not dealing with actual physical pain here, just hate the minty fresh feeling in my mouth. Does mouthwash cause pain for you? I’ve never really used it, but briefly wondered if I could use a fluoride free toothpaste plus a fluoridated mouthwash, but I think I ran into the same issue with limited fluoridated flavors.
Mouthwash does not cause pain for me, but I think that’s pretty disgusting and I’m currently dealing with a different health problem that involves heaving. Hooray shitty genes. I may resort to it one day if I have to.
I read your comment earlier today and then by chance was going to reorder toothpaste tonight, and I realized the kind of toothpaste I recently fell in love with has a citrus and a grape flavor, so I hunted down your comment to share with you!
The toothpaste has both fluoride and hydroxyapatite, which helps rebuild enamel. Ever since I started using hydroxyapatite, my teeth have that “fresh from the dentist clean” feeling every time I brush them. I was using a Japanese brand of toothpaste for a few years because that’s the only place I found that kind of toothpaste, but it was fluoride free. Just one tube ago I found a brand that has both!
The brand is Carifree, and this is the one I use.
Looks like they also have citrus and grape mouthwash!
And I thought I was crazy when I paid $10 for a 6oz tube! Hahah. I do need a new dentist though, so I might just try one of the dentists near me that carries their stuff so I can grab a tube.
Yeah, I should have mentioned the price is pretty insane… I’d desensitized myself to it a bit because of the whole buying-Japanese-toothpaste thing wasn’t cheap, and now I just can’t stand not using hydroxyapatite for more than like a week, lol.
I love cinnamon, it’s so hard to find anymore, in contrast to your hatred, I wish they made more of it, but I also believe that they should be open to more flavors that aren’t just oriented toward children.
Huh. I see quite a few cinnamon options online, but I wouldn’t be surprised that it’s harder to find in physical stores. They really seem to be cutting back on options everywhere lately. I found a brand that I like, so I just order a few tubes at a time from their website.
Aquafresh Extreme or whatever has a citrusy taste with a hint of mint. I love it, but my fiance hates it. It’s called Mint Blast, but it’s so minty that it doesn’t taste minty to me.
You might like it, or you might hate it with the fire of a thousand suns.
Ok so seems clear to me there’s no real harm, but is there alleged benefit for adults? I’ve never had to rely on a municipal well so as a kid I had fluoride treatments and used fluoridated paste, but always thought it was just for kids. Is there benefit for me as a 40yo (with no cavities if it matters)?
Fluoride in water is the reason you have no cavities and will continue to have few to no cavities. Centuries ago you’d be lucky to have your teeth, the toothpaste definitely helps but the fluoride in water probably has a bigger impact on society overall
Sorry, you misunderstand. I don’t rely on a municipal well, and adding fluoride to private wells isn’t a thing AFAIK.
That’s why as a child I had fluoride treatments. It would have been easier to just get it in the water, but tradeoffs. My kids get them too.
I was wondering about the fluoride treatments being child only or whether there were adult benefits.
There are adult benefits, yes. Fluoride re-mineralises teeth (in contrast to cavities) to a super-physiological state. Meaning: If tooth enamel is in the beginnings of a cavity state fluoride will fight that process and possibly repair the enamel to a state stronger than before.
I’m a sane libertarian (I promise some of us do exisit). People absolutely have a right to determine what goes in to their body, but fluoride is such a weird hill to die on. In particular when fortified grains are a mandate of the same ilk. All of this has a history, and shocker, it was always steeped in the same “but our culture” wrapping…
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=reYKBgdrZsM&pp=ygUWUGVsbGFncmEgZXh0cmEgaGlzdG90eQ%3D%3D
Yeah, it seems like complaining about government provided WiFi.
“What if I don’t WANT my kids on the internet dangit!?”
Put the lithium in already.
Fuck it, put in arsenic
Ah. The benefits of being a boron based lifeform.
heavy metal riff
We should not be encouraging the least among us.
And yet the least among us is now the Republican candidate for president.
Again.
… Again.
I’m running for president?
There’s at least one person worse than you and he’s running for president.
Tom Hanks?
Just let the fuckers teeth fall out already. I am tired of so much effort being spent on people who clearly want to die. It is everything, from seatbelts to motorcycle helmets to vaccines to transfats to HFC drinks. They want to die? Let them. Maybe darwinism will save us from them maybe it won’t but at least we can all stop hearing about it.
Hi, I’m shit at brushing my teeth long enough/regularly enough. I am glad fluride is in the water.
Hi I’m someone who has concerns about animal testing and is sensitive to SLS causing mouth ulcers/generally ruining taste for a while, unfortunately hippy toothpaste often lacks fluride for insane reasons. I am glad fluride is in the water.
Hi I’m a kid with horrible parents that neglect my dental care. I am glad fluride is in the water.
“Just let people hurt themselves” is never that easy.
There are fluoride rinses you can buy for fairly cheap
We let people raise kids with religion
Could you be a little less online about stuff. If you’re lile 15 and just coming out of indoctrination with limited support around I forgive you, otherwise Jesus christ mate get a grip.
Sorry no one is buying your shit Xian
Do you talk to people like this in real life?
Did you enjoy your weekly pretend time this Sunday, Xian?
A slicht problem with this approach is that for vaccines to be effective for anyone almost everybody has to be vaccinated…
Over enough time the only remaining people will be the vaccinated.
I’m pretty sure people criticized Republicans when they cheered on the whole “let them die” thing…
Medical freedom? Can’t people use bottled or just move to a town with naturally high fluoride?
They’re talking about the freedom of morons to not drink fluoride.
OK use bottled water or move to a city that doesn’t need to add it
It doesn’t make any more sense the second time you say it.
They don’t want to live in a place with naturally high fluoride. They don’t want to drink flouride.
Most bottled water is just tap water with extra plastic waste. Nobody should be drinking bottled water if they can avoid it.
bottled water is often just tap water, and im pretty sure nestle isn’t a big enough dumbass to start removing shit that’s actually just beneficial to people.
This comes up in Portland periodically as we are one of the few places that DOESN’T fluoridate water.
When you do the research on it, you find some fascinating things:
Applying fluoride topically through toothpaste or mouthwash unequivocably works wonders for tooth decay.
There is no evidence drinking it as part of the water supply does ANYTHING. Positive or negative.
You have to understand one big thing… The first municipality to add fluoride to water did so in 1945.
The first fluoridated toothpaste wouldn’t hit the market until 1955, 10 years later (thanks Crest!)
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/second-thoughts-on-fluoride/
So when you look at studies trying to determine if drinking water as a source is effective, you need to immediately ignore any study done before the introduction of fluoridated toothpaste and mouthwash.
…people didn’t just… stop researching fluoride after the 40s/50s. Newer studies have found less of a dramatic benefit, likely because brushing with fluoridated toothpaste is more common, but there is still a significant benefit. The countries that reduced water fluoridation and saw little to no change have universal free dental care for children.
A lot of the pushback relies on pointing out that there are diminishing returns. Multiple sources of fluoride don’t seem to have compounding benefits. But that completely ignores that the goal is to raise the baseline.
Not all kids are good at brushing their teeth, not all parents care or know to put it as a priority if they’re struggling. It’s not going to impact virtually anyone above the poverty line, but for the people who need it most it absolutely helps.
Fluoridating water is ridiculously cheap way to add a layer of safety. A ~15-25% reduction in cavities is absolutely worth pursuing.
I’m pretty sure the dentists love this.
I’m pretty sure if dentists are advocating for something that would make them less money in the long run, that whatever they’re advocating for is a good idea.
I thought it’s used instead of chlorine to decontaminate water
Water is disinfected with either chlorine, chloramine (ammonia + chlorine), ozone, or UV light. In North America chlorine is almost universal because it provides disinfection residual, which keeps water safe while it is travelling from the treatment plant to the consumer. Fluoride is added solely as a supplement to improve dental health.
Yeah, looks like I mixed fluoride with ozone
For once, the answer to a question posed in the headline is obviously yes.
yeah. Im happily surprised the article itself was not about the conspiracy nonsense.
It’s still platforming the conspiracy though and bringing it to more people’s attention.
I don’t think bringing attention to conspiracy theories as conspiracy theories is bad. If anything its a good thing. I mean if it was the about the lizard aliens or flat earthers it would be the same.
I’m not so sure about that after the last 8-9 years of political discourse in the US. You assume bringing light to them means people will see how ridiculous they are, but in reality they just bring the conspiracy into the forefront, where people then take sides and dig their heels in.
Trump getting a ton of coverage as the laughing stock candidate leading up to the 2016 election gave him the edge he needed to win while the rest of us thought the coverage would lead to a landslide victory for his opponent.
