NEWS FLASH: GOP Still Shameless Liars!
In a statement, Kentucky Attorney General Russell Coleman accused President Biden of being “willing to sacrifice the American auto industry and its workers in service of its radical green agenda.”
If you look up the 10 most “Made in America” cars, the top 4 slots by a huge margin are Tesla Model 3,Y,S,X , which are all EVs, and they are at near 100% (or 100% for some models). There isn’t another American car brand on the list. So when Coleman is talking about sacrificing American auto workers, who’s he talking about? A car that is 40% American because all the parts are made in China or Mexico and there’s some final assembly done in the USA?
P.S. Musk is an idiot, though I’m not sure that needs to be said anymore as its so obvious.
the top 4 slots by a huge margin are Tesla Model 3,Y,S,X
Is that true? I saw recently that 95% of Tesla’s cars are the Model Y. I assume a huge chunk of the remaining 5% is the Model 3, leaving very few Model S and X cars on the road. I’d be very surprised to hear that either one of them is in the top 4 best selling American made cars.
Edit: Just looked up this article of best selling cars in 2024, which includes non-American made cars.
Removing those, it looks like it’s:
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Ford F-Series: 152,943 units sold
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Chevrolet Silverado: 127,563 units sold
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Tesla Model Y: 109,000 units sold
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Ram Pickup: 89,417 units sold
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GMC Sierra: 68,597 units sold
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Ford Explorer: 58,465 units sold
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Jeep Grand Cherokee: 54,455 units sold
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Chevrolet Equinox: 54,185 units sold
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Tesla Model 3: 42,000 units sold (Looks like my 95% number was way off)
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Ford Transit: 39,890 units sold
I’d be very surprised to hear that either one of them is in the top 4 best selling American made cars.
I said nothing about top sales. I said “most made in America”. As in: of all cars sold in the USA, what are the top 10 which contain the most American manufactured parts and labor".
Oh gotcha, I misunderstood. Yes they are very much made in America. Seeing people complain about them and acting patriotic because they drive a Ford cracks me up.
how was that figured out? most evs have a less complex manufacturing process and rely on a shitload of electronic components that aren’t manufactured domestically. i’d be interested to see the methodology!
i’d be interested to see the methodology!
You’re welcome to read this 158 page PDF from the CBO https://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/97th-congress-1981-1982/reports/1982_08_16_domestic.pdf
The main legislation comes from the Automobile Information Disclosure Act.
i meant the claim that teslas are the top made in america cars. i looked and found cars.com’s list of the most made in america cars and their dubious Made in America Index and that’s about it.
i also want to just throw an electronics manufacturing industry scoff at the CBOs methodology. i used to work for an electronics manufacturer that did mostly pcb assembly. a bunch of the work was government contracts or prestige stuff that had to say “made in USA” on it as opposed to the more clear symbol of a hollowed out manufacturing sector, “assembled in USA”. every day truckloads of parts from china would get soldered to PCBs from iirc taiwan and that was enough to earn made versus assembled.
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Honestly, dumping tons of money into tech that has so many problems may not he the best idea.
It’s almost like any new technology starts out with problems that get solved through time, money, and resources.
…that shouldn’t be provided by the government.
So you want to end subsidies for oil and gas, for farmers to grow corn that gets turned into ethanol, or just subsidies for EVs? Let’s be clear here.
So I take it you’re against the government subsidizing science research in general? “The government shouldn’t fund new technology” is a stupid and destructive position. We’d be living in the 1800s if it were up to solely the capitalistic market. I mean, the first broadly effective antibiotics that are responsible for saving probably hundreds of millions of lives at least only exist because of people working in government-funded labs, under government-funded universities, for the government. Why should the environment be treated like it doesn’t matter to our civilization?
Are you vegan or something? Without government subsidies, beef would cost Americans like $25 per pound. But you don’t want subsidies on anything?
How do you think technology matures? It took years for automobiles to become reliable like they are today. It’ll take years for EVs to become mature, but the only way to do that is to work on them now and improve as we go along. The absolute wrong thing to do is throw out the entire concept because they aren’t perfect now.
Agreed. The innumerable problems that coincide with fossil fuel based technology means it’s a terrible idea to continue to subsidize it at taxpayer expense.
What problems
OK, let’s just get rid of cars altogether, then.
You can pry my car out of my cold dead fingers
you’re a dumbass. The advocates for a car-free society want to make it so that owning a car is not mandatory because alternatives will exist.
It is not mandatory now, although it is convenient.
Cmon go so far right you hit the left and start advocating for public transit and improved mixed use infrastructure to “own the libs”
The weird part is, when you actually talk to a Conservative irl, they don’t care about EVs. Sure they might not like them—they might even think they’re a Political scheme or whatever. But they at least understand that there are more important things happening. Politicians failure to represent their user base’s viewpoint in the US is always astounding.
Look up thos congresspersons’ donor history
Bet my bottom dollar they’re getting donations from groups that tie back to the auto industry
Get the fucking money out of politics
Are we in a “free market” or we not? The answer is “depends on what lobbyists want.”
To play devil’s advocate for a moment, is it really a free market if we are incentivizing one technology over another?
When the oil industry doesn’t have to pay to clean up their externalities we already don’t have a free market. You break it you pay. Fixing the externalities by incentivizing better technology is at minimum a correction to the market.
That argument can be made about the tax incentives.
However, regulations about emissions are intrinsically something we want, and we shouldn’t hold back on that just because gas cars can’t get to the level of emissions we need.
Lol without all the subsidies gas would be $12/gallon. And burning fossil fuels (40% is automotive) kills more than 250,000 Americans per year. Whats the cost of a human life brah?
Whats the cost of a human life brah?
That depends on if grandma is being evaluated by an Obama Death Panel (life is precious and invaluable) or by the stock market in 2020 (she has, what, a couple years left anyway, let her die).
In the US there is only one metric: Dow Jones death panel. The insanity of our culture is that Obama Death Panels were an invention of the Dow Jones death panel board to rally the lemming brained right against the concept of public healthcare (the horror!). Oh yeah, obligatory fuck Joe Lieberman.
I think they’re more commenting on how the supposedly “free market” champions constantly interfere with the market when it suits their agenda
Exactly. Those people tend to be extreme hypocrites.
Yeah but in this case (EVs) it’s way better for public health and the “interference” is still a fraction of the scales tilted in fossil fuels favor.
Yes, that’s the point. These politicians interfere and meddle and cry “free market” when it is convenient for them.
Would have been far easier to just type “there is no free market”
Exactly I am not getting all this subsidy unfairness nonsense that stops Chinese firms from selling cars here. The only difference I’m seeing is that we’re subsidizing cars on the back end through oil subsidies, and they are subsidizing cars on the front end with production subsidies.
Are we in a “free market” or we not?
Not.
Only when it helps to keep the poors in their place.
Not even only. The recognized goal of the modern marketplace is to achieve monopoly. Billionaires write entire textbooks on the subject.
Free market goes to the highest bidder.
Free market involves pluralism of systems and distribution of power as important preconditions. Lobbyism requires monoculture of systems and power being sufficiently centralized to be controllable.
Also, the free market is a tool, not a utopia. It optimizes for whatever the people setting the limits of it make it optimize for.
Hence things I said. Otherwise the wheel is free for taking for the worst people.
Free for me and not for thee.
Might as well be the offical preamble of the Constitution (or at least the more conventional “rules for thee, not for me”).
Good, the taxpayers shouldn’t be subsidizing rich peoples tech toys.
Who pays for the roads?
Roads are critical infrastructure, a luxury vehicle is not.
Electricity isn’t critical?
In terms of road costs, the vehicle being electric or combustion isn’t particularly relevant in a country where the most popular vehicle crosses the scales above 4,000 pounds.
People that pay the tax on gasoline.
Why wouldn’t they? They are, after all, the craven whores who thirst for corporate donor cock.
EVs are being built to save the car industry not the planet. I’ll probably get an electric vehicle once the kinks get worked out but I know how the materials are acquired and what happens when the batteries can’t hold a charge. It’s a baby step but definitely shouldn’t be stopped from evolving.
what State’s have battery fabs? not KY, obviously - but, others, presumably?
what State’s have battery fabs? not KY, obviously - but, others, presumably?
Set to start production next year:
Is this why Elon is working so hard to run Tesla into the ground? 5d chess, something something…
They are trying to discredit Elon it is just getting dumb
If by “they” you mean Elon himself then yes and it sure is getting dumb.
Elon has next to nothing to do with Tesla…
Elon singlehandedly decimated the future of the Supercharger network, and by extension the future of Tesla.
Elon Musk, the CEO of company, has next to nothing to do with Tesla?
He hasn’t really been present much. They call him the pigeon CEO
Then why is he asking shareholders to approve a $56 billion personal pay package? Seems kinda steep for a guy who isn’t really present…
He hasn’t taken a salary in years
EVs are good an all but. they are just data collection machines. Electricity don’t grow on trees and I don’t even have a place to plug one in although I briefly rented a prius once (far from home ) and I liked it charging it whenever I was able to was convenient and on the limited commute I used it , I could get away with charging it on specific places and barely needed the gastank. I guess if you Americans have those large-homes garages parking spaces . and better infrastructure they are good for that put for ppl parking on the street and live on a flat at least where I am, finding a charger is a luxury. but even in your countries electricity is mostly fossil fuels isn’t it ? still better than polluting the road adjacent areas I guess. anyways these were my issues on the limited time I tried and ev an contemplated about buying one not related to republicans or America I know but adoption related ?.
Newer gasoline/petrol cars are also data collection machines. False dichotomy there.
Even if the electricity comes from fossil fuels, the efficiency of large plants is far better than that of individual combustion engines; and it provides better opportunity to replace the source with something renewable or at least safer, like solar, wind, or nuclear.
I ain’t buying a new car period ( not like I have money ) and a decent small hatchback like a polo or fiesta from early to 2010 would prolly be the best I can afford or a kia or hyundai might be a tad bit more affordable . I’d steer clear from anything newer not necessarily by choice but the whole cars becoming applications thing is def contributing to it
You are right. But I think EV charging generates more data than gas.
That would be fine if they were trying to reverse ALL personal vehicle adoption, but nooo.
The problem with this is that this will encourage Canada to do the same, like the good little brother it is, and we’ll get fucked along with y’all -_-
Inb4 “both parties are the same”.
While I hate stuff like these rollbacks, we are already starting to see EVs save people money on gas and service, and they are stupidly fast compared to ICE counterparts. That’s something Americans of all stripes can get behind.
Once I tried an ebike, I realized I never wanted to go back to gas engines. So fast, so much torque, and pennies to charge vs $70 gas tanks at Costco (even more at a normal gas station). It just makes economic sense to run PEVs in all major urban areas in addition to mass transit.
With traffic and some protected bike lanes, even a conventional bike can almost beat a car in a 7-14 mile drive in my city. An ebike makes it even easier.
Both parties are the same doesn’t mean that they have literally the same policy it means that they work together and focus on Republican policy. Because there are only two choices the fact that the Democrats are perpetually the weaker half despite having a much greater Democratic majority including during voting when you claim that it matters it means that the Republican policy always gets passed.
So basically, one side is a hive mind that’s required to always do what its most powerful members want, and the other has free thinkers that sometimes disagree, and you’re saying that the latter is weak, pointless, and should never exist.
Buddy, this is a terrible definition of “weak”. What you’re describing is a goddamn borg cube.
Both sides are the same hive mind that do what their most powerful members want, unelected oligarchs who pay for both parties elections, the other side are maybe better intentioned but tools of the same system designed to structurally lose to the other side despite what the votes state.
I never said just the democrats, the weak side, is pointless and should never exist in this way. I think the US government is an evil and corrupt oligarchy that maintains order by nuclear terror and are run by the modern versions of Nazis and shouldn’t exist. Your internal politics are a stupid joke and another circus.
I have arrived! Both parties are the same! No affordable EV’s for you! Keep slurrrrping that petrol!
Hike tariffs on Chinese EVs, Senate Democrats urge Biden administration
“Artificially low-priced Chinese EVs flooding the U.S. would cost thousands of American jobs and endanger the survival of the U.S. automotive industry as a whole.”
we are already starting to see EVs save people money on gas and service, and they are stupidly fast
- there was an article on measurable air pollution improvements in I think San Francisco, attributed to EV use
- the stupidity on industrial policy gets me: EVs are a new industry growing fast, and Chinese companies are growing fastest. Effing idiots want to throw away the chances for American companies to get into the new market. Sure, be more profitable for the next quarter while watching your legacy market dry up and don’t even try to make your mark. Somehow this is all twisted up in Sinophobia and racism and we’re in Bizarro World where everything is opposite
I’d be riding an ebike right now, if I knew how I could park it safely :/ do you typically bring it with you?
I use an Oxford Monster chain and U lock. I park my bike in highly visible areas. Registered it with 529 garage and have the tracking sticker on it. And if I’m really sketched out, I activate a bike alarm that is ungodly loud.
Mostly, it’s about making your bike harder to steal. Cutting through 12mm chain and a standard ulock sucks. Getting caught with it being easily identified on 529 makes it risky to steal and easy to be returned. Some cities also do bike valet or bike lockers.
I mean, how much does your e-bike cost? If you can get one, especially a used one for a relatively affordable price and you actually sit down and tally up car costs like insurance, gas, maintenance, AAA, tires, any number of other costs…. I don’t think it matters if someone occasionally steals your e-bike (outside of it being extremely frustrating and inconvenient). Someone could steal your e-bike every 6 months or so and you likely will still be spending FARRRRRR less buying a new/used electric bicycle than you would just owning a car and using it and then having to deal with the insane never ending bullshit costs of keeping a car on the road.
So idk, build up a savings so you can replace your e-bike if you need to and then just use it. So long as you get a years use out of it or so it has already earned you quite a bit of money from cutting car costs.
Get one of those e-bikes with a removable battery with a key lock, then take your battery so if someone steals your bicycle they can’t steal the actually expensive part.
“It doesn’t matter if someone occasionally steals your bike” is… one hell of a crap take.
Why? Using a car you can lock up seems like a better alternative intuitively, I am pointing out that other than the emotional distress of having an object of yours stolen, owning a car is a regular rolling disaster of costs and suffering that dwarfs somebody running off with your $800 used e-bike every couple of months.
How is this a bad take? It is literally a documented phenomena that people don’t rationally take into account how expensive owning and using a car is.
