Keep it polite people. 🙂
Easy: even if you vote for Bernie that’s still at best center-left. The US just really, really leans right overall: there’s center-right (democrats) and far-right (republicans) and that’s about it.
You guys are so afraid of socialism no party dares venture the true left.
Americans being afraid of socialism is proof that propaganda works. It’s literally for the people.
As does decades of systematically defunding education. The decades of leaded gas/paint by prior generations probably weren’t helping…
Here in Czechia, we had socialism a few decades ago. Pretty much everyone old enough to remember it hates it.
Socialism is not a ‘one thing’ . It’s a concept as a whole. You can have good or bad socialism and everything in between.
The world is far more nuanced than that.
Do you have working examples of good socialism?
I’ll give some examples of great implementations of socialism that drives welfare in today’s democracies, as I personally believe that socialism can’t exist without democracy, as it’s one of the core values of the concept, that’s it’s controlled by the people.
One of socialisms ultimate goals are also equality, which my examples will show.
- Free education
- UBI if you get fired
- UBI for old people
- UBI for students
- Free health care (duh)
- Free dental (normally only till age of 18 today)
- Basic insurance paid by the government
These are just the big ones that really helps to make sure that very few people are actually poor and are getting desperate because of it.
Also, it’s always important to say that socialism and capitalism are NOT mutually exclusive. It’s perfectly normal to have all these concepts from socialism in a capitalist country.
I think we can agree that a country with 100% capitalism or socialism is not the best way to go.
Good explanation. Just one nit to pick over word choice: “Capitalism” is not a synonym for “free market”.
Capitalism is a separate ideology that champions (even romanticizes) the acquisition and hoarding of wealth at all costs. It leads to trusts, monopolies, stifling of competition and, eventually, the death of the free market.
In other words: Socialism and free markets are compatible. Socialism and Capitalism are not.
Because what the US considers left (universal health care, helping the poor, school lunches and affordable education) is considered middle of the road normal stuff in Europe and other developed countries.
As a proud American wingnut, I vehemently denounce these so-called “benefits” that you claim are merely considered middle-of-the-road in other parts of the world. Let us break it down for the sake of argument.
First off, Universal Health Care is nothing more than a government-controlled monopoly on healthcare services. This is the first step toward socialized medicine, which has proven to be detrimental to the medical industry worldwide. In the name of equality, doctors will no longer strive to excel in their fields, as their paychecks will not reflect their efforts. The result? A decline in quality of care, longer wait times, and diminishing innovation in the field. This is how the slippery slope begins!
Next on your list is ‘helping the poor.’ While this sounds like a noble cause, it must be understood that government intervention is neither necessary nor effective when it comes to uplifting individuals out of poverty. It’s time we stop enabling dependence on handouts. Instead, we should promote personal responsibility and self-reliance—core American values, after all. Only by standing on one’s own two feet can a person truly gain an appreciation for life’s hardships, and ultimately, its rewards.
Moving onto school lunches, let us examine our Founding Fathers’ vision for the country. They cherished individual freedom above all else. By providing free meals to students, we’re essentially stifling entrepreneurship by removing the incentive for young people to start businesses that could potentially provide lunch services to schools. Additionally, such measures only serve to deepen the divide between the haves and have-nots. Why should children who are fortunate enough to receive these free lunches continue working hard if they know they’ll always be provided for?
Last but not least, affordable education is nothing more than a clever Trojan horse for communist brainwashing. When the cost of higher education is reduced, the barriers to entry for subversive ideologies also decrease. We cannot sit idly by while our youth are corrupted with socialist propaganda. In fact, the price tag of college tuition serves as a natural selection process that ensures only those who value their education will pursue it, consequently maintaining the quality of graduates entering the workforce.
In conclusion, I implore you to reconsider your support for these so-called “middle of the road” concepts. These policies may sound pleasant in theory, but make no mistake; they’re merely disguised stepping stones toward a godless society where individuals cease to think or act independently. The American Dream would die a slow and painful death under this system. First, free lunches, next COMMUNISM!
I guess the downvoters either didn’t get the joke, or completely agree with what you typed and noticed the sarcasm. 🤷🏻♂️
I’m tempted to downvote because the “parody” is also literally what a lot of people on the right literally think. There’s zero difference between this comment written in jest and the same comment written totally honestly. That means this potentially spreads that idea, however absurd it sounds to us.
In the end I didn’t downvote because I think if people are here they probably understand how stupid it is for it to be serious. If this were Reddit I would probably downvote because odds are some right-wing idiots would think it agrees with them and see the upvotes as confirmation of their ideas.
This hurts to read.
I know it’s satire, but this is like… 5% more satirical than actual beliefs on the topic at some points. The helping the poor section in particular.
There’s no leftist party, nothing Socialist in the least. The furthest “left” you go is the DNC, which is liberal, and therefore right wing. The furthest right you go is the GOP, which is fascist.
Other people have already posted good answers so I just want to add a couple things.
If you want a very simple, concrete example: Healthcare. It depends on how you count, but more than half the world’s countries have some sort of free or low cost public healthcare, whereas in the US, the richest country in the history of countries, that’s presented as radical left wing kooky unrealistic communist Bernie idea. This isn’t an example of a left-wing policy that we won’t adopt, but of what in much of the world is a normal public service that we can’t adopt because anti-socialism in this country is so malignant and metastasized that it can be weaponized against things that are just considered normal public services almost like roads in other countries.
A true left wing would support not just things like healthcare, but advocate for an economic system in which workers have control over their jobs, not the bosses. That is completely absent.
Also, this meme:
It’s glib, but it’s not wrong. Both parties routinely support American militarism abroad. Antimilitarism in favor of internationalism has been a corner stone for the left since the left began.
@return2ozma@lemmy.world One way to think about “the left” is that it values freedom from domination. Who in the US is fighting to reduce the level of domination we experience in important areas of life (health care, education, food, housing to name a few)? Should we really have to pay and put ourselves into debt–thereby becoming dominated–to go to school, live somewhere, or maintain our health? Even the so-called left in the US supports this arrangement generally; at best they fight over the details, not the structure itself.
The reason that type of left is ignored because it’s dumber than libertarianism. At least the mirror of it realizes someone has to pay for it (perhaps those want to use it), and just doesn’t like the coercive mandate. You, though, both don’t want to be coerced AND think it all oughtta be free because…forcing people to give you free shit is not being dominated? “I want to be a lazy bully” isn’t the intellectual flex you think it is.
You have never once engaged honestly with what a leftist believes.
I’ve never ate horseshit either.
Really? How’d it get in your mouth then, for you to spit it everywhere?
Is this what passes for clever in your mind?
I chuckled a bit when I wrote it.
I think there’s value in what you’re calling attention to.
“Freedom” vs “domination” though has nothing to do with the left or right of a government (in theory). You’re actually referring to libertarianism vs authoritarianism, which is (again, in theory) independent from economic structure.
Nah bud. you can’t separate social theory from economic theory in general terms. They are one and the same. How your currency is used and controlled and by who for what is social theory.
They are related (in practice) but I disagree that they’re one “and” the same. Freedom from domination can exist in the left or the right.
Demonizing the views that you don’t hold as inherently opposed to freedom is how the US got to this point in this awful no spectrum of views two party system in the first place.
(By the way, just noticed your username. How’re’ya’now bud?)
Freedom from domination cannot exist in the right, as domination is the method by which production occurs. The right must whitewash domination, clean it, yet still use it, to operate.
Are you suggesting that there is no production without domination?
No, not at all. I’m suggesting that when production is directed by an owner class, the worker class is dominated. If the workers collectively or individually own the means of production, there is no domination.
On that point I’m with you! It’s painfully obvious in today’s wealth disparity in the US.
Where it breaks down for me is your argument that it’s only possible to have a dominating dynamic in a right wing regime. Would you really argue that the CCP does not impose a dominating dynamic over the people of China?
No. Capitalism, feudalism, monarchism, and so forth are built on domination, ie hierarchy, while leftist structures such as Socialism, Communism, and Anarchism advocate collective ownership so as to combat this.
What leftist party is there in the US that is centered around some form of Socialism that controls any meaningful amount of the State?
That’s only a meaningful question if the only “true Left” is a Leftist political party that is centered around some form of Socialism that controls a meaningful amount of a State.
Not necessarily. A Syndicalist or otherwise Anarchist-derivative party doesn’t exist either, and no similar coalition exists on the ground with widespread impact on the Capitalist status-quo, yet.
I really hope you’re not trying to insinuate that the DNC are somehow left wing.
A lot of people have left-leaning economic views ( tax the rich ) but there’s basically no political or media representation of those views. ( because the rich run the media and government )
