I an so sick of the “just don’t buy it” response to people complaining about increasingly shitty practices. It’s like if someone pisses in the far side of the pool and other people decide they like the warmth so they tell you just to stay over on the far side - The pool is still tainted, and maybe next time the pool cleaners decide not to use chlorine…
I don’t understand how that comparison fits because somebody else buying the portal has literally no impact on my game. Someone pissing in the pool is directly
impacting you with their actions.
It only affects you if they tell you. Otherwise it’s hidden to you, too, so the comparison is apt.
Similarly, the company focuses on these mocrottansaction features, which does affect where they spend time developing and also how they design and develop the game.
No because regardless of my knowledge of it or lack thereof I am still swimming in urine, which is a health risk and just gross as hell. This is a bad analogy.
Yep, and just like that, those who don’t partake in mocrottansactions are participating in a game that is tailored to mocrottansactions. How it looks, plays and feels are all affected.
Just like the pool, you can be blissfully unaware and knowing makes it decidedly worse, but it’s worse whether you know it or not.
Someone peeing in the pool, however gross, is uncaring not evil. I find it odd that rather than reconsider how you thought about it, you double down on accepting it.
I’m not sure if you’re aware, but every pool you’ve ever been in has pee. Every pool. Most people don’t even bother to wash their hands.
The smell people associate with a chlorine pool is actually the smell of the compound created by the chemical reaction of pool shock cleaner and human piss.
If it smells like classic pool? Its probably piss.
And youre currently swimming in a urine filled game, because 1/4 of dev time, money, and company resources are spent on actual game content while the other 3/4 go towards the next round of store items.
The pool is lower quality because of the piss. You can still swim just fine. So shut up and swim. Right?
The game is lower quality because of the focus on microtransactions. You can still play just fine. So shut up and play. Right?
I think the analogy is that it sets a precedent. Now the other companies see how you can pee in the pool and folks are either cool with it (buy) or are on the other end (not buy but meh). Now the pool standard is piss filled pool and we will never have a chance to get into a clean pool anymore.
If you want to take a swim you have to do it in a pissed soaked pool because we never complained or did anything about it.
But that’s assuming there’s only one pool. If everyone leaves for a pool without piss in it, the first will probably change their policies to not allow peeing in their pools because it drives away customers.
The problem isn’t that there’s only one pool, the problem is that not enough people seem to care enough to try a different one. Instead, they just complain about the pool they’re at, perhaps because the pool is free or it gets a lot of advertising.
So yeah, feel free to complain about it, but your time is probably better spent just going to a different pool.
I haven’t played a Blizzard game in something like 10 years. Whether they manipulate their customers has zero impact on the games I play, so I’m basically in a completely different pool from them. The way I see it, there are lots of different pools, such as:
F2P games - has always been a cesspool, and always will be
online multiplayer - recently turning into a cesspool
big budget single player - generally good, though “early access” (pay extra to pay a few days really) isn’t great, but I avoid new releases generally because they’re so consistently buggy, so it’s not an issue
indie/AA - generally great, and this is where I spend most of my time and money
I almost never play F2P or competitive online multiplayer games, so they’re essentially a completely separate pool from the games I play, which are largely single player games from smaller studios (and a few big budget single player games).
So no, it’s not one big pool, there are clear separations.
The issue is that there is only 1 industry. And the end goal of ALL developers and companies is making money. The more the better. When other pools start seeing that pissong in the pool leaves them more money, than they ALL will start designing their games around this. It is this design choice that will infect pretty much all other games. The precedent it sets affects the whole industry.
And like you said before, the only way this is not an issue is if it does not generate additional money for them so that no other pools try to imitate. And this will only happen if nobody buys them. And this post is trying to dissuade those buyers so that this does not become rampart and then all games have it.
But it’s not just one industry, unless you overly generalize.
The motivations that lead someone to buy indie games are much different than someone who mostly plays F2P competitive games, which is much different than the group that buys top end AAA games. So the marketing and profit model will be different for each. I think there are at least these logical segments:
mobile gaming
casual gaming (i.e. Switch)
F2P gaming/eSports
AAA gaming
indie/small studio gaming
Each of those has different target demographics, and thus different “pools.”
Do you honestly believe that complaining on Lemmy counts as “doing something about it”?
I only know about this thing because of this post. I’m not going to buy it, but do you see that what you’re doing is getting the word out and doing blizzards advertising for them?
As a consumer we can use our choices where we spend to lead companies one way or the other. Spreading the word to not buy something is “doing something about it”. How effective it may be here in Lemmy, probably not very much, but it’s something.
It’s not that you can’t complain, but moreso that people are tired of reading about people getting ripped of over and over again.
It’s getting old when the solution is so glaringly obvious.
Alternatively focus your grievances towards the company. That has a better chance of making an impact in reducing the tainted waters.
So in short: you have a right to complain, but we have a right to tell you that you are a part of the problem if you pre-order or support companies continually doing this crap.
Alternatively focus your grievances towards the company.
But why would the company care? They’re marketing directly to a certain kind of person here. Anyone that would pay these prices - and plenty must pay because Blizzard hasn’t blinked ONCE during any of this bullshit - has so much money that they wouldn’t care if the colors were three times that.
Blizzard acts like their bread and butter is the upper-middle-class and it must be true because they don’t change at all as near as I’ve been able to tell. Not only do their sales not take a hit, they just keep growing.
Oh I agree with you wholeheartedly friend!
They don’t care because people keep buying their shit anyways, which is why many of us tell you to stop buying it and then we’ve gone full circle again.
I’m not recommending complaining to them because I think they will care. I do it because I it could have a greater impact than complaining here which has exactly zero impact.
All this while there are plenty of other companies worth supporting. Sure it isn’t your favorite franchise, but we aren’t surprised leopards ate your face, again. I gave up on all those games from these companies and have found a lot of enjoyment elsewhere. Sucks but I refuse to give them money that makes this a viable model for them to fuckup over and over.
Seriously start taking risks on “indie” developers. I know a lot of them aren’t really indie - they’re huge companies with dozens of employees in a lot of cases still, but you’ll find they treat you better. Sure - that $20 game might not be quite as good, but in other cases, I’ve seen them be EVEN BETTER than $70 titles.
Unfortunately it is pretty obvious that the majority of the human population are just going to follow what they’re told to buy via TV and Ads. There aren’t enough of us to turn the tide right away, but hey – stick to your guns, and tell others to as well. It’ll take a bit for players to get well and truly fed up with this shit, but the tide will turn eventually.
First they did it at EA, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play EA games. Then they did it at Ubisoft, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play Ubisoft games. Then they did it at Blizzard, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play Blizzard games. Then they did it at fromsoft games, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play fromsoft games. Then they did it at supergiant games, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play their games.
Then they did it at every other fucking company because it was industry standard.
Then they did it at every other fucking company because it was industry standard.
All you’ve listed are the big publishers. Of course THEY are going to do it. They are publicly traded company’s where they need to draw blood from a stone and pull out as much value as possible to appease their shareholders.
You’re absolutely wrong about every company doing this. It sounds like your only experience is AAA titles.
Play some indie games and you’ll see the difference. Significantly better designed games, built from passion, and without all the bullshit you see with AAA games.
Like I said find a better pool where people aren’t pissing in them. They exist.
I used recognizable names, including respected names such as fromsoft and supergiant which aren’t even doing it. The point I was trying to make was that the more normal and accepted it becomes, the more it will be done and it might eventually become the norm. Like the YouTube title/thumbnail trend. “We have to do it because of the algorithm! We don’t make money otherwise”
I didn’t say that there are no good games. But genres have been drowned in these microtransaction games enough that it has become disruptive. I find myself sometimes playing games that are in many ways inferior to older games because they are trying to be low-budget disruptors in a market where the high budgets are largely “filled with urine” as it were.
Look at a few companies’ recent “people are just going to have to get used to subscriptions/microtransactions” attitudes. It’s going the same way television has gone. One cannot pretend in good faith overall quality in entertainment is not going down for reasons that the decisionmakers know to be hurting the products.
I know this is a metaphor, but where exactly do they exist? If you’re in a public pool, it’s not like you can go to another town and use theirs. And if it’s your own, chances are you only have one.
Public pools aren’t the only pools. There are literally millions of pools in the world. You have options even when you think you don’t. If you limit yourself to the one and only public pool in town then you’re limiting yourself by only thinking in a box.
There are hundreds of thousands of games in the world. Many of them aren’t AAA garbage fleecing their customers. If you limit yourself to only AAA games then you’re limiting yourself by thinking in a box.
Go on and explore the world already. You have more choices than you think you do.
I respect your opinion but I see it differently. There are thousands of pools filled with nice clean water and a few pools filled with piss. Some people decide to jump in pools full of piss and afterwards act surprised and complain about the piss. Now other people tell them to “just don´t jump in piss”.
I an so sick of the “just don’t buy it” response to people complaining about increasingly shitty practices. It’s like if someone pisses in the far side of the pool and other people decide they like the warmth so they tell you just to stay over on the far side - The pool is still tainted, and maybe next time the pool cleaners decide not to use chlorine…
I don’t understand how that comparison fits because somebody else buying the portal has literally no impact on my game. Someone pissing in the pool is directly
impacting you with their actions.
It only affects you if they tell you. Otherwise it’s hidden to you, too, so the comparison is apt.
Similarly, the company focuses on these mocrottansaction features, which does affect where they spend time developing and also how they design and develop the game.
No because regardless of my knowledge of it or lack thereof I am still swimming in urine, which is a health risk and just gross as hell. This is a bad analogy.
Yep, and just like that, those who don’t partake in mocrottansactions are participating in a game that is tailored to mocrottansactions. How it looks, plays and feels are all affected.
Just like the pool, you can be blissfully unaware and knowing makes it decidedly worse, but it’s worse whether you know it or not.
Extra credit for correctly using affect!!!
Effective education affects us all. Now if only my spell check didn’t correct to mocrottansactions, whatever that is.
I would argue that’s far more indirect and it’s not a 100% evil act to include microtransactions/skins.
Someone peeing in the pool, however gross, is uncaring not evil. I find it odd that rather than reconsider how you thought about it, you double down on accepting it.
I’m not sure if you’re aware, but every pool you’ve ever been in has pee. Every pool. Most people don’t even bother to wash their hands.
The smell people associate with a chlorine pool is actually the smell of the compound created by the chemical reaction of pool shock cleaner and human piss.
If it smells like classic pool? Its probably piss.
Yes.
And youre currently swimming in a urine filled game, because 1/4 of dev time, money, and company resources are spent on actual game content while the other 3/4 go towards the next round of store items.
The pool is lower quality because of the piss. You can still swim just fine. So shut up and swim. Right?
The game is lower quality because of the focus on microtransactions. You can still play just fine. So shut up and play. Right?
I think the analogy is that it sets a precedent. Now the other companies see how you can pee in the pool and folks are either cool with it (buy) or are on the other end (not buy but meh). Now the pool standard is piss filled pool and we will never have a chance to get into a clean pool anymore.
If you want to take a swim you have to do it in a pissed soaked pool because we never complained or did anything about it.
But that’s assuming there’s only one pool. If everyone leaves for a pool without piss in it, the first will probably change their policies to not allow peeing in their pools because it drives away customers.
The problem isn’t that there’s only one pool, the problem is that not enough people seem to care enough to try a different one. Instead, they just complain about the pool they’re at, perhaps because the pool is free or it gets a lot of advertising.
So yeah, feel free to complain about it, but your time is probably better spent just going to a different pool.
The pool is the gaming industry dude, not whatever shitty little game blizzard is putting out.
No, it’s not.
I haven’t played a Blizzard game in something like 10 years. Whether they manipulate their customers has zero impact on the games I play, so I’m basically in a completely different pool from them. The way I see it, there are lots of different pools, such as:
I almost never play F2P or competitive online multiplayer games, so they’re essentially a completely separate pool from the games I play, which are largely single player games from smaller studios (and a few big budget single player games).
So no, it’s not one big pool, there are clear separations.
The issue is that there is only 1 industry. And the end goal of ALL developers and companies is making money. The more the better. When other pools start seeing that pissong in the pool leaves them more money, than they ALL will start designing their games around this. It is this design choice that will infect pretty much all other games. The precedent it sets affects the whole industry.
And like you said before, the only way this is not an issue is if it does not generate additional money for them so that no other pools try to imitate. And this will only happen if nobody buys them. And this post is trying to dissuade those buyers so that this does not become rampart and then all games have it.
But it’s not just one industry, unless you overly generalize.
The motivations that lead someone to buy indie games are much different than someone who mostly plays F2P competitive games, which is much different than the group that buys top end AAA games. So the marketing and profit model will be different for each. I think there are at least these logical segments:
Each of those has different target demographics, and thus different “pools.”
Do you honestly believe that complaining on Lemmy counts as “doing something about it”?
I only know about this thing because of this post. I’m not going to buy it, but do you see that what you’re doing is getting the word out and doing blizzards advertising for them?
As a consumer we can use our choices where we spend to lead companies one way or the other. Spreading the word to not buy something is “doing something about it”. How effective it may be here in Lemmy, probably not very much, but it’s something.
It’s not that you can’t complain, but moreso that people are tired of reading about people getting ripped of over and over again.
It’s getting old when the solution is so glaringly obvious.
Alternatively focus your grievances towards the company. That has a better chance of making an impact in reducing the tainted waters.
So in short: you have a right to complain, but we have a right to tell you that you are a part of the problem if you pre-order or support companies continually doing this crap.
But why would the company care? They’re marketing directly to a certain kind of person here. Anyone that would pay these prices - and plenty must pay because Blizzard hasn’t blinked ONCE during any of this bullshit - has so much money that they wouldn’t care if the colors were three times that.
Blizzard acts like their bread and butter is the upper-middle-class and it must be true because they don’t change at all as near as I’ve been able to tell. Not only do their sales not take a hit, they just keep growing.
Oh I agree with you wholeheartedly friend!
They don’t care because people keep buying their shit anyways, which is why many of us tell you to stop buying it and then we’ve gone full circle again.
I’m not recommending complaining to them because I think they will care. I do it because I it could have a greater impact than complaining here which has exactly zero impact.
All this while there are plenty of other companies worth supporting. Sure it isn’t your favorite franchise, but we aren’t surprised leopards ate your face, again. I gave up on all those games from these companies and have found a lot of enjoyment elsewhere. Sucks but I refuse to give them money that makes this a viable model for them to fuckup over and over.
Seriously start taking risks on “indie” developers. I know a lot of them aren’t really indie - they’re huge companies with dozens of employees in a lot of cases still, but you’ll find they treat you better. Sure - that $20 game might not be quite as good, but in other cases, I’ve seen them be EVEN BETTER than $70 titles.
Unfortunately it is pretty obvious that the majority of the human population are just going to follow what they’re told to buy via TV and Ads. There aren’t enough of us to turn the tide right away, but hey – stick to your guns, and tell others to as well. It’ll take a bit for players to get well and truly fed up with this shit, but the tide will turn eventually.
Use a different pool where people aren’t pissing in them. They exist.
There are plenty of other games that don’t pull this shit. Play them instead.
First they did it at EA, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play EA games. Then they did it at Ubisoft, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play Ubisoft games. Then they did it at Blizzard, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play Blizzard games. Then they did it at fromsoft games, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play fromsoft games. Then they did it at supergiant games, but I didn’t say anything because I don’t play their games.
Then they did it at every other fucking company because it was industry standard.
All you’ve listed are the big publishers. Of course THEY are going to do it. They are publicly traded company’s where they need to draw blood from a stone and pull out as much value as possible to appease their shareholders.
You’re absolutely wrong about every company doing this. It sounds like your only experience is AAA titles.
Play some indie games and you’ll see the difference. Significantly better designed games, built from passion, and without all the bullshit you see with AAA games.
Like I said find a better pool where people aren’t pissing in them. They exist.
I used recognizable names, including respected names such as fromsoft and supergiant which aren’t even doing it. The point I was trying to make was that the more normal and accepted it becomes, the more it will be done and it might eventually become the norm. Like the YouTube title/thumbnail trend. “We have to do it because of the algorithm! We don’t make money otherwise”
In fairness to the complaints, there are fewer and fewer good clean pools, and they tend to be the less-and-less awesome ones.
How so? I’ve had no issues finding games to play that don’t suck
I didn’t say that there are no good games. But genres have been drowned in these microtransaction games enough that it has become disruptive. I find myself sometimes playing games that are in many ways inferior to older games because they are trying to be low-budget disruptors in a market where the high budgets are largely “filled with urine” as it were.
Look at a few companies’ recent “people are just going to have to get used to subscriptions/microtransactions” attitudes. It’s going the same way television has gone. One cannot pretend in good faith overall quality in entertainment is not going down for reasons that the decisionmakers know to be hurting the products.
I know this is a metaphor, but where exactly do they exist? If you’re in a public pool, it’s not like you can go to another town and use theirs. And if it’s your own, chances are you only have one.
Public pools aren’t the only pools. There are literally millions of pools in the world. You have options even when you think you don’t. If you limit yourself to the one and only public pool in town then you’re limiting yourself by only thinking in a box.
There are hundreds of thousands of games in the world. Many of them aren’t AAA garbage fleecing their customers. If you limit yourself to only AAA games then you’re limiting yourself by thinking in a box.
Go on and explore the world already. You have more choices than you think you do.
I respect your opinion but I see it differently. There are thousands of pools filled with nice clean water and a few pools filled with piss. Some people decide to jump in pools full of piss and afterwards act surprised and complain about the piss. Now other people tell them to “just don´t jump in piss”.