Chinese authorities wrongfully detained more than 20 Tibetans and severely tortured a Tibetan village head named Gonpo Namgyal to death with the repeated use of electric equipment in detention for several months in Ponkor township, Darlag County in Golog in the traditional Tibetan province of Amdo now incorporated into Qinghai, Sichuan and Gansu provinces.

    • mercphilby@discuss.onlineOP
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      1 day ago

      So if there was photographic evidence, it would be manufactured?

      What kind of evidence would convince you?

      Would it need to be reported on by a specific CCP controlled news source?

      • freagle@lemmygrad.ml
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        It would need to be reported by more than one source, those other sources can’t cite this report as their source and the source can’t be a mouthpiece for a government in exile that has decades of history collaborating with the CIA.

        That would be a start.

        As a bonus, it would need to include contextualized information about how this would be extremely counter productive to all of the aims of China’s relationship-building with the Tibetan people and how this would represent a huge shift in that relationship.

    • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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      2 days ago

      Having seen the quality of the slop, I know it’s an easy grift.

      Radio Free Asia[1]: Tibetan champion of language preservation dies after release

      Gonpo Namgyal, leader of Ponkor Village in Qinghai province’s Dharlag county, or Dari in Chinese, was arrested with the abbot of Shangtoe Monastery and over 20 other Tibetans in May for engaging in activities to promote the preservation of Tibetan language and culture, said the two sources who spoke on condition of anonymity due to safety concerns.

      China has stepped up efforts to erase Tibetan language use, including the closure of private Tibetan schools, the establishment of boarding schools where children are taught primarily in Mandarin, the prohibition of informal Tibetan language classes during winter break, and the organizing of Mandarin speech competitions in monasteries and schools.

      Hmm, where have I heard this story before? 🤔

      📽️

      Meanwhile at Wikipedia[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action_in_China

      • Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        2 days ago

        Holy whataboutism, Batman! 🤦

        Indigenous people in North America being displaced and oppressed does NOT in fact make it acceptable for the Chinese government to oppress and ethnically cleanse Tibetan people.

        If anything, NOT committing crimes against humanity all the time would be THE most effective way for China to distinguish themselves from their geopolitical adversaries in a positive manner.

        TL;DR: Nice try, but just as two wrongs doesn’t make a right, the similar but separate atrocities of Western countries don’t excuse those of China in any way.

        • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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          Holy whataboutism, Batman! 🤦

          Citations Needed podcast: Whataboutism - The Media’s Favorite Rhetorical Shield Against Criticism of US Policy

          Since the beginning of what’s generally called ‘RussiaGate’ three years ago, pundits, media outlets, even comedians have all become insta-experts on supposed Russian propaganda techniques. The most cunning of these tricks, we are told, is that of “whataboutism” – a devious Soviet tactic of deflecting criticism by pointing out the accusers’ hypocrisy and inconsistencies. The tu quoque - or, “you, also” - fallacy, but with a unique Slavic flavor of nihilism, used by Trump and leftists alike in an effort to change the subject and focus on the faults of the United States rather than the crimes of Official State Enemies.

          But what if “whataboutism” isn’t describing a propaganda technique, but in fact is one itself: a zombie phrase that’s seeped into everyday liberal discourse that – while perhaps useful in the abstract - has manifestly turned any appeal to moral consistency into a cunning Russian psyop. From its origins in the Cold War as a means of deflecting and apologizing for Jim Crow to its braindead contemporary usage as a way of not engaging any criticism of the United States as the supposed arbiter of human rights, the term “whataboutism” has become a term that - 100 percent of the time - is simply used to defend and legitimizing American empire’s moral narratives.

          We are joined by Jeremy Scahill, co-founder of The Intercept.


          Nice try, but just as two wrongs don’t make a right, the similar but separate atrocities of Western countries don’t excuse those of China in any way.

          Still waiting on the evidence for those similar atrocities.

        • AntiOutsideAktion@lemmy.ml
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          Indigenous people in North America being displaced and oppressed […] Chinese government to oppress and ethnically cleanse

          hey look another western chauvinist (read: white supremacist) doing genocide denial

          UwU smol widdle bean amewica only did a lil scoot scoot to the indians

          • Grapho@lemmy.ml
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            Building schools and maintaining extensive affirmative action (even excluding minorities from the one child policy) is literally ethnic cleansing.

            Killing, jailing, using biological weapons, enacting a century of land grabs and torturing/killing everyone who couldn’t escape, that’s just displacement. The good guys did it, after all.

        • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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          If anything, NOT committing crimes against humanity all the time would be THE most effective way for China to distinguish themselves from their geopolitical adversaries in a positive manner.

          How fucking ironic that you say this.

          • Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            Only if you miss the fact that I’m implicitly conceding that Western nations are ALSO committing crimes against humanity.

            The world isn’t a binary where you have to deny some atrocities in able to be capable of condemning others.

            • AntiOutsideAktion@lemmy.ml
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              Excuse me, I’m just going to go murder someone to gain the superpower of being able to accuse anyone I want of being a murderer

            • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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              Oh, how magnanimous of you, lol.

              Still deeply ironic that you said that though, while perfectly demonstrating exactly why it isn’t true.

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                Oh, how magnanimous of you, lol.

                Never said that there’s anything magnanimous or otherwise special about acknowledging objective reality rather than ignoring anything that contradicts tribalist dogma. Just because you’re incapable of it doesn’t make it a flex.

                Still deeply ironic that you said that though, while perfectly demonstrating exactly why it isn’t true.

                That makes no sense whatsoever.

                • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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                  You acted like anyone should give a single nutty shit that you were so nobley willing to concede that the US is bad (but only as bad, never worse), despite it being completely irrelevant.

                  That makes no sense whatsoever.

                  Lol, Westerners really are the most brainwashed people on earth: they can’t even parse ideas contrary to their programming, let alone accept them.

                  • Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                    You acted like anyone should give a single nutty shit

                    Nope. Just clarifying what you missed and how it negated your claim about mine being ironic.

                    you were so nobley willing to concede that the US is bad (but only as bad, never worse)

                    Yet another strawman. Sometimes the US does worse things than China, sometimes China does worse things than the US. Neither ever cancel each other out as committing atrocities is NOT a zero sum competition.

                    despite it being completely irrelevant.

                    Again, me being able to acknowledge atrocities without resorting to whataboutism is relevant. As is your inability to do so.

                    Me reaching the absolute baseline of intellectual honesty doesn’t make me special. You not accomplishing even that makes YOU special.

                    Lol, Westerners really are the most brainwashed people on earth: they can’t even parse ideas contrary to their programming, let alone accept them.

                    Wow. That’s Donald Trump levels of lacking self-awareness 😆🤦

        • m532@lemmygrad.ml
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          But china doesnt do that

          Projection is when the usa propaganda takes one of its own crimes and changes all mentions of “usa” to “china”

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            I’m pretty sure china does because that’s what all authoritarian empires have done and are doing throughout history.

            If there’s no evidence it just means they covered it up well enougg

            • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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              https://www.greanvillepost.com/2018/10/06/left-anticommunism-the-unkindest-cut/

              In the United States, for over a hundred years, the ruling interests tirelessly propagated anticommunism among the populace, until it became more like a religious orthodoxy than a political analysis. During the Cold War, the anticommunist ideological framework could transform any data about existing communist societies into hostile evidence. If the Soviets refused to negotiate a point, they were intransigent and belligerent; if they appeared willing to make concessions, this was but a skillful ploy to put us off our guard. By opposing arms limitations, they would have demonstrated their aggressive intent; but when in fact they supported most armament treaties, it was because they were mendacious and manipulative. If the churches in the USSR were empty, this demonstrated that religion was suppressed; but if the churches were full, this meant the people were rejecting the regime’s atheistic ideology. If the workers went on strike (as happened on infrequent occasions), this was evidence of their alienation from the collectivist system; if they didn’t go on strike, this was because they were intimidated and lacked freedom. A scarcity of consumer goods demonstrated the failure of the economic system; an improvement in consumer supplies meant only that the leaders were attempting to placate a restive population and so maintain a firmer hold over them. If communists in the United States played an important role struggling for the rights of workers, the poor, African-Americans, women, and others, this was only their guileful way of gathering support among disfranchised groups and gaining power for themselves. How one gained power by fighting for the rights of powerless groups was never explained. What we are dealing with is a nonfalsifiable orthodoxy, so assiduously marketed by the ruling interests that it affected people across the entire political spectrum.

            • freagle@lemmygrad.ml
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              You’re sure China is doing it is because (checks notes), Europeans did it?

              Listen to yourself. You are not engaged in reasoning, you are engaged in projection.

              Consider that China has watched European empire so this sort of thing, determined it to be ineffective at producing a stable society, and is choosing to not do that thing.

            • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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              Damn, you’re just straight up doing the thing from the Parenti quote without even pretending otherwise.

        • wurzelgummidge@lemmy.ml
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          NOT committing crimes against humanity all the time

          I’m sure you can provide reliable evidence of all these crimes against humanity. Evidence that is not merely made up assertions from western news media, politicians, and other dubious sources. But I won’t wait up.

          • Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            I’m sure you can provide reliable evidence of all these crimes against humanity

            Nope, not all of them. Not because they didn’t happen. Because there’s too many to list in a week of non stop writing, which is about a week more than your bad faith requests deserve.

            Evidence that is not merely made up assertions from western news media, politicians, and other dubious sources.

            Yeah, you haven’t made up your mind already, nuh-uh! You’re DEFINITELY completely objective and the keeper of the Real Truth! 🙄

            But I won’t wait up.

            Wow, what a vicious and original barb! You must be feared throughout the lying West! Such eloquence! 🤦

            • OBJECTION!@lemmy.ml
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              Nope, not all of them. Not because they didn’t happen. Because there’s too many to list in a week of non stop writing, which is about a week more than your bad faith requests deserve.

              Awfully convenient how everyone always draws this arbitrary, bizarre moral line in the sand about how they can’t provide any evidence for any of their claims about China.

                  • Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                    points to the majority of history

                    Take your pick. I’m not being paid to reach you what you should already know and would if not for your ideological blinders.

                • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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                  Westerners like you truly are the most brainwashed people on earth.

                  Also it’s fucking hilarious that you’re calling other people tankies when you were calling for people to be lined up against a wall and shot less than an hour ago.

                  • Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                    Westerners like you truly are the most brainwashed people on earth.

                    Again with the famous tankie self-awareness

                    Also it’s fucking hilarious that you’re calling other people tankies when you were calling for people to be lined up against a wall and shot less than an hour ago.

                    Yeah, because using a figure of speech means that I want that thing to literally happen 🙄

                    Doesn’t it hurt to be more dense than a neutron star?

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                Nope, you’re supposed to believe it because it’s already been thoroughly and accurately documented countless times for several decades.

                Your willful ignorance of history is neither my fault nor my responsibility.

                  • Viking_Hippie@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                    Far too many to mention. You’re acting exactly like a Zionist does whenever a human rights org, scholar, journalist, or anyone else points out the obvious abuses of the Israeli apartheid regime.