I have a conundrum, maybe people in this thread can weigh in.
I’m a woman living in an area with a small but loud MAGA faction and useless police who are probably also Trump supporters. I’m also not white.
Hunting is common here, and although I’ve never been I do know how to shoot and have access to classes if I want to improve. We also have friends and family with firearms and a couple of them live nearby.
I feel like I should get a gun. I know how to use one and I want to be able to protect myself if necessary. But I’m scared of firearms. Something about them disturbs me. Maybe it’s the likelihood of someone dying once a gun comes out. Maybe it’s just a fear, however unfounded, that I can’t or shouldn’t handle such a powerful tool. But the reason behind the feeling doesn’t matter so much as my ability to overcome it, and I’m not sure I can. If I had money to burn I’d buy one just to see how I feel, but I don’t so I can’t.
In short, I’m torn. I want to be able to just get a gun for peace of mind and call it a day, but I fear that as soon as the gun is in my house I will become a nervous wreck and that will defeat the whole purpose.
I’d love to hear from anyone who feels the same or has overcome this fear.
A thing to maybe consider is to get a subscription at a range and check out a rental firearm to plink on the range. You lose some money in the experience like going to a movie or whatever, but you’re not out the full price of the firearm. Then you can decide how you feel. Granted, active fire is much different than object that sits on shelf. They’re quite docile when stationary. Even so, it’s just psychologically weird normalizing the thought of, “I have a device on this shelf that has only one purpose, to delete life.” Sure, hammers, nailguns, knives, etc. can be used for killing, but they have a useful primary purpose. Guns don’t.
Training and familiarization helped me a lot with that exact feeling. I had the same feeling about circular/table saws. My dad was a carpenter, and those things freaked me the hell out - one tiny mistake could have devastating consequences, and that was all I could think about when I was around them. But with careful instruction and exposure, learing to use and be more comfortable with them, that feeling was gradually replaced by calm and confidence, and they changed in my mind from these objects of terror into valuable tools. There was still fear, but it was a healthy, respectful fear.
I went through the exact same process with guns as well. Some classes with a good instructor, giving you a chance to get more comfortable and familiar before you bring a gun into your home, could help a lot.
I don’t own a gun and feel the same as you. I am leaning toward getting a gun safe and keeping the gun and ammo locked up and hidden. If it gathers dust that’s great, but having it there if I need it would be a comfort I think.
You do not want to have a gun that you’re not comfortable with. Having to deal with a high stress situation and then trying to use a gun when you don’t have brain-dead levels of familiarity with it is asking the trouble. Luckily it’s fairly cheap to build most of the muscle-memory with dry-fire and handling drills. But if you plan on using it for home defense or personal protection, you need to be prepared so that your mind can focus on other things during your troubles.
Comfort for what? An armed mob laying siege on your house? If someone breaks in unexpectedly are you going to ask him to wait while you open the safe?
Take a reputable course and learn about guns. They are dangerous in the hands of irresponsible untrained yokels but if you are smart and informed they can empower you and safeguard your well being.
Guns have traditionally been a pacifier for anxious right-wing weirdos who are afraid of Nancy Pelosi, but they are also a good hedge against those right-wing weirdos and will be a pacifier for your anxiety about them
Everything you’re describing is completely reasonable. For the past decades, left-wing “policy ideas” have floated banning guns or at least some form of gun control. They state statistics, examples from other countries, testimony from gun experts, etc etc all describing how perfectly harmful just owning a gun can be and how unlikely you are to ever run into a situation where a firearm will improve your situation and chances of surviving.
This has been overtaken by the rhetoric of “they’re coming for you!tm”. The exact same playbook that was used by the right-wing. Who wins? The gun manufacturers and war profiteers.
It’s amazing to see the collective consciousness just completely glaze over from just a few years ago. If you think you’re statistically more likely to be targeted, then it’s your right to procure a firearm in the United States and I’ll leave it at that. But, if you actually look into it, you’ll find you will be put more in danger by having a firearm in the house than not.
You’re right about the mental aspect, if you own a firearm and are constantly thinking about it and the threats it can protect you from, you’ve created your own hellscape that many are already in. It’s much safer and better for the community to be involved in your neighbors lives and to form bonds with those close to you in a positive manner. Somehow, everyone’s forgotten the examples the rest of the world has set forth and have fallen into Americana again.
Good. Gun rights are human rights. All people have the right to defend themselves and those around them. Taking that away by banning the only tool that evens the playing field is not OK.
Just ignore all the dead kids. They’re not part of this discussion.
There is going to be a lot more dead minority and marginalised people if they don’t make it possibly lethal to fuck with them.
I’m all for guns but keep them responsibly. Which most gun owners seem completely incapable of doing so.
most gun owners seem completely incapable of doing so.
You got a source for “most” gun owners being “completely incapable of doing so?”
Cause I’ve yet to see a study that says any of what you said above.
School shootings on the regular, that’s your study in real life.
The fact that there are more guns than people is one of the top reasons children die in America.
And what percentage of gun owners are the source of the weapons of school shooters?
And before you go off on a tangent, gun regs are a good things, background checks are good, red flag laws are good.
And what percentage of killings in the US and death by kids and otherwise are caused be guns?
There are more guns than people in the USA. The numbers dont really paint the picture that most gun owners can’t safely own guns.
The fact that there are more guns than people is one of the top reasons children die in America.
Considering they’re just above traffic fatalities I suppose it would be fair to say most drivers are incapable of safely keeping cars too.
You would be correct.
Who would’ve thought humans can’t responsibly operate literal death machines?
You mean Americans, not people. This is not a normal thing in the rest of the world, only America.
You mean the country that has more guns than people has a gun problem?? No fuckin way.
I defend myself with a tiger and feed it highschool kids. Statistically, I’m an insignificant lunatic.
This is the blue conservative version of “your body, my choice”. Well that and the bipartisan war on drugs.
Now playing The War On Drugs - I don’t live here anymore
Stay strapped or get clapped…
It feels like they picked the worst screenshot intentionally though when talking about that YouTuber…
Like, maybe it’s a new kind of magnifier that you flip up to use instead of off to the side to not use. But that AR just doesn’t look like whoever built it knew what they were doing.
Like the BLM protests where it was obvious people went out and bought ARs just for the event and didn’t even put sights on beforehand.
That being said don’t wander around gun YouTube on your account it only takes a couple videos for the algorithm to decide you’re a gun nut, and that comes along with a bunch of other rightwing videos, because normally it does.
But Reagan is the one who passed Cali’s gun laws, and he did so because people he didn’t like were marching with guns.
Obviously it would have made more sense to start when Biden was in office, but it seems like unless protestors carry guns, the cops will just beat them without a second thought.
If they even think some have guns tho… Cops won’t do shit.
If cops get return fire in a (leftist) protest/riot, they’ll come back with MRAPs and live rounds and re-enact Kent State. They live for that moment.
Oh, and that magnifier is on a Unity FAST mount, and yes, it flips up to get in position. It’s on a higher sight plane along with the Eotech to help with shooting while using things like night vision goggles, and a lot of people say it’s more natural and comfortable for fast shooting in general. It’s actually some Gucci shit and looks squared away to me.
Weird, I never saw one of those before, but if it works it’s way better than hanging off to the side.
And I think you’re forgetting how much cops are cowards. They won’t go into a school when it’s one kid with an AR and they have a seat team.
They’ll say they want a firefight all fucking day, when they get the opportunity they shit their pants.
But we know how they treat unarmed protestors, and the difference when there’s guns present.
Can confirm, my wife has expressed an interest. We’re just waiting for the local LGBTQ friendly range to open.
The other local ranges are either run by cops (ACAB) or require NRA memberships to join. Yeah, that’s not happening.
Hey, you’re in PDX, right? Do you have recommendations?
Go out into the woods. You can shoot on most BLM land.
She needs something more regimented than that. She won’t do well free-form. :)
Not trying to belabor the point or anything, but with some planning you can make it regimented. I’m in northern CA, and been taking small groups out to a local BLM spot on the weekends. A big reason is to avoid the chuddy vibes at local ranges. We bring targets, do some instruction and have clear guidelines. We measure distances and we clean up our brass.
The one we’re waiting on is called Wooster Armory in Tigard/Beaverton. Kinda by Washington Square, by the Guitar Center. The gunshop is open, but it looks like they’re having trouble getting the range open. I’m going to pop in and say “Hi!” today and see what the deal is.
Threat Dynamics in Sherwood is good too, I did my AR training there.
Perfect, thank you!
As a fellow PDXer this is valuable information.
Fascinating business opportunity, queer gun shops.
Sometimes you have to open the gun range you wish to see in your neighborhood.
Or something like that. I think Gandhi said it.
Nothing gets republicans talking about gun control faster than minorities arming.
Time to get out of this country.
We as leftists, must organize in ways that match the fascists. Subversion of their goals is our goal. The class and culture war is in full effect and we must not be complacent.
Ive had one for a while. It’s not something I hope to ever use, but now it’s less likely that an armed person will be coming after me for my money, which I can just give and not have to kill to defend myself, and more likely they’re coming for my life.
American ‘solutions’ for American problems
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Yep. Still have my dimesized scar
It’s a shame they’re inherently dangerous, hence why they aren’t used anymore. They have a high risk of spreading infection when blood/fluid ricochets back into the device while administering a dose. Thus contaminating the next one to be administered. Basically, the risk isn’t worth the convenience.
I still think they’re pretty cool. They’re the real life inspiration for Star Trek’s hypospray. Many people would love a device like this since fear of needles is quite common.
One colleague of mine has a huge fear of needles. She basically had to be held down by four people while getting her covid shot. It was necessary, she consented to the manhandling… but a device like this would’ve made it a lot less stressful for her to get the shot.
What would you do in this situation?
Use knives and poison
Stuff that doesn’t take 10 levels into rogue to work
Im a liberal guess who now has a gun safe with multiple guns?
I guess we are making America great again by arming the liberals too?
Also by helping the struggling gun industry
I get that but im surrounded by people with guns who could take everything from me if they chose to.
Are you sure you have enough guns?
I have enough to stop a bear or nazi
there’s an easy solution: only buy foreign made guns.
Sweden: for when you need a gun but don’t want to fund domestic fascism, and also need some cheap furniture while arming yourself …and maybe could I get one of those fighter jets on the side?
The Czech Republic thanks you.
It’s not that easy. The vast majority of imports are banned and the remaining sporting imports are subject to significant restrictions. The overwhelming majority of guns sold in the US are produced in the US, even ones from foreign manufacturers. It’s not that dissimilar to cars.
I wouldn’t say that it’s the ‘vast majority’ of imports that are banned. The Gun Control Act of '68 mostly ends up applying to very small, often cheap, pistols (“Saturday night specials”), and guns that don’t have a “legitimate sporting purpose”. The ATF has said that practical shooting competitions (e.g., two gun, three gun, etc.) doesn’t count as “legitimate sporting purpose”, but the IWI Tavor is sold in the US, and is manufactured in Israel. source for that claim
Right now Turkish guns are having a moment. The Turks are making cheap firearms–sometimes very good, sometimes just cheap-- and sometimes making outright clones of more popular popular firearms. True, you’d be supporting Erdogan, but hey, you can’t always win.
Personally, I’m waiting for someone to start importing KMR pistols. The KMR L-02 Orca OR looks like an improved CZ Shadow II Orange, but I suspect the $3200 price tag is lot steep for most people. :(
Turkey is actively killing and repressing the kurds of Syria, such as Rojava, so if we’re boycotting US manufacturers, might be good to avoid turkish one’s too if possible, to deprive their government of tax revenue.
I’m not really sure if there is an ‘ethical’ choice with the big manufacturers anywhere, just different degrees of bad, though definitely worth indirectly supporting the less bad option.
You could opt for small boutique builders that explicitly support leftists and trans, like KE Arms, but those are few and far between. Best resource I can find is this list from the liberalgunowners reddit wiki.
Alternatively, opt for buying used guns from lefitist gun stores (if you have one near you, or can order from them online to a local ffl). That’s probably the best option from a cost and ethics perspective.
I will personally vouch for Russell at KE Arms; he genuinely believes that the second amendment is for all people, regardless of race, gender identity, sexual orientation, or religion. He’s a good dude, IMO.
But fundamentally, yeah, it’s nearly impossible to buy a firearm that is 100% ethical. I know that Karl Kasarda (InRangeTV) likes Desert Tech, because they’ve been good to IRTV and haven’t given him shit about politics, religion, or affiliation with marginalized groups. I don’t like Desert Tech, because they’re run by the Kingston Clan, which is a fundamentalist Mormon cult. I’m also unwilling to buy from Daniel Defense, because they actively market themselves as being a “Christian corporation”, and I oppose that kind of religious bullshittery.
Point is, you gotta pick and choose.
Why are Americans answers to everything guns? So much paranoia and mental health issues in this country it’s insane.
I mean rapists, transphobes, bigots, and neo Nazis all now feel carte blanche freedom to do whatever they please in this country. There will absolutely be more crimes against women, LGBTQ+, minorities, and liberals. Not arming yourself against these animals is the insane thing.
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People radicalized to insane culture war bullshit and irrational solipsistic oblivion cults can’t really be negotiated with.
You realize that it sounds like you’re talking referring to trans people and allies in this comment right? Just to be clear, which group are you referring to?
‘oblivion cults’ makes it clear they’re talking about right-wingers
No, Right Wingers use that exact language as well. What they posted sounds a lot like vague posting to me.
Naw. ‘Oblivion cults’ is very clearly referencing doomsday ‘christians’, the Evangelical sort that are common in America. They want the world to end, they think they’ll be raptured into heaven.
They’re also idiots, if the rapture happens, they’re not coming; they are the equivalent of the Pharisees that Jesus whipped, and Revelation specifically mentions them, and that they are fools
Right Wingers love to coop language. I’ve heard some that language used in GameGate circles. They love referring to the inclusion of minorities in games with hyperbola.
A quick peek at dude’s posting history makes it pretty clear they’re a leftist, so.
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My issue with your comment was that it was being vague. You were using the same language that Right Wingers use to describe trans issues.
What would you suggest? I have three trans friends who are making plans to move, at least for a few years, but not everyone can do that.
It’s me, another trans who is actively applying to move out of the US. If I were staying here I’d be arming myself too even though I hate everything about guns. I’ve been voting, protesting, community aid, talking with people I know, building relations with my neighbors, it’s all backsliding anyway. Not a lot of options left for me
They are very welcome to come here to Washington! Just don’t live too far from the cities or east of the Cascades.
No, they’re looking moving out of the country. They already live in a liberal state. They’re looking to rent out their current home and just hold out in another country for 4 years and see how it works out. One is of Jewish ancestry and knows their history. Trump promised to send troops into sanctuary cities and they don’t want that to be the one honest thing he’s said.
Look to what other countries do maybe, they don’t answer every single problem with paranoia and guns.
1 a republican in office l so we can’t count on any law changing for the better. 2 even if we did reform gun laws the these people won’t give them up. A lot of them won’t even save their own children from disease
Ok, how exactly do you think we can implement those changes in a Trump regime?
If you look at the one side of the political spectrum that seems to be usurping power over here, they fucking LOVE guns. It wouldnt surprise me that if they got violent, it would be armed heavily with firearms. This is the exact response i would expect from would be victims of aforementioned gun violence. in the words of my constituion and bible humping american brethren, we shall NOT BE VICTIM TO A TYRANNICAL STATE!
Well, we can’t effectively ban guns. At least not in our foreseeable political future. And the people who are already armed are overwhelmingly voting to elect a fascist who likes to incite violence among minority groups… It’s kinda easy to see why people would want to arm themselves.
Feuer frei!
Own a corporation that owns all of your property. Have many guns. It’s the American way.
Lol, this thread is a train wreck and is the perfect example of Republicans keep winning elections despite being on the wrong side of history and having policies that hurt the American population at large.
The left will never win as long as we form circular firing squads and argue over petty bullshit.
I like how your comment is the perfect example of the behavior that you claim to oppose. You’re cutting into the left while identifying yourself as left, and everything you wrote was destructive. Congratulations?
There are several reasonable positions that a person could take on this issue. You could point out the entertainment in increased calls for gun regulation. You could point out the consistency with saying that you’re going to arm yourself as long as guns are legal, but also be in favor of increased gun regulation. You could point out that there are different factions within the Democratic party and on the left in general, and how people all have their own varying agendas. You could encourage a general strategy for Democrats and Democrat supporters to get along. But you did none of that, because you didn’t care. And I don’t mind if you care, but I want other people to see it, just in case they do.
Or you could understand that “gun ownership” and “gun regulation” are not incompatible concepts, despite NRA/Russian propaganda to the contrary.
The dude is trying to give some necessary criticism, but apparently everyone is immune to that.
Criticism is not destruction, unless you are okay with the current status quo
Criticism should be constructive, they offered nothing constructive in their criticism.
Keep forming that circular firing squad.
I’m going to slip out and duck down over here and eat some popcorn.
Nah man, people in here are not open to criticism unless it’s “the way they like it” which is none criticism at all.
Just blame the Latino voters and move on
firing squads
You need guns for that.
lol
why do you think the guns are pointed in a circle
Because the whole “I need a gun now” reaction is just people trying to assuage the fear and uncertainty of the future. While there will continue to be random violence against minorities and lgtbq, the predominant way they will be hurt going forward is via policy. Policy that marginalizes them. Arming up because you think right wing mobs are going to enact a pogrom against you is no different than right wing nuts arming up because they think a caravan of criminal mexicans is heading toward the border. Don’t fall into the trap of thinking you are “in control” because you took a shooting class and bought a pistol. When we are afraid we naturally want to “do something” about it. But as soon as you reach for a weapon you’ve lost.
Easy to say when you aren’t facing the threat of bias intimidation or hate crime by recently emboldened bigots, things that actually happen unlike the caravan paranoia.
Triangles are too pointy
So very much this.
ah i see Aleksandr Dugin’s book is coming along as he planned.
