When given a choice between a millitary industrial neoliberal with a rainbow voting base and a fascist who is one elon musk golf session away from banning HRT, the best option is certainly not to refuse to play out of protest
When given a choice between a millitary industrial neoliberal with a rainbow voting base and a fascist who is one elon musk golf session away from banning HRT, the best option is certainly not to refuse to play out of protest
And remember to vote for whoever you want. Just because you vote third party doesn’t mean your vote is wasted or to vote for somebody else because who knows who you would have voted for if it wasn’t for third party. Those people that say that shit can fuck off.
yes but also if you’re in a swing state maybe don’t vote third party for the executive office. Rn the thrid party persidential candidates aren’t super strong, and the bulk of political momentum is bipartisan. Local and state gov is a totally different situation depending on your state.
like the working families party, who acutally have some substantial influence in the new york area
Working Families is actually stronger than the democrats out here. I vote WF everywhere their name pops up. They got governors in out here in Oregon.
I’m a big supporter of the working families party. They rule. I honestly think they have the best chance of any of the third parties of eventually becoming a viable player in the American political sphere
(Also WF backed Harris/Walz, they’re not dumb enough to try to tamper with the big race.)
it’s such a smart move. best third party by far
empowering parties in this way could pave the way for future third party presidential candidates
Good point. A candidate from a party that doesn’t really have a presence in any level of government and especially zero seats in congress will probably never have a realistic chance of winning the presidential election, barring some exceptional circumstances. If you like a third party, trying to make it viable at the local level and moving up from there seems to be the only realistic option to me.
Except it is wasted because there is literally zero chance a 3rd party candidate will win the presidency. If we’re talking lower offices, then maybe, but if you’re not voting Harris then you are directly assisting Trump.
Because of all the second-party candidates who are supporting trump by still voting harris while knowing a lot of people are appealed by her support for extermination.
Why are you a trump supporter?
There is value in showing third parties are growing more popular. It’s the first step that needs to happen for a third party candidate to become truely viable.
The first step that needs to happen is building up a third party through local politics, not ignoring politics for 3 years and 11 months and then suddenly expecting a third party to become viable.
Oddly enough, we don’t need advice from Democrats on how to run our party, because they want us to fail.
“If you don’t agree with me 100% you must be against me.”
Oddly enough the same thing “3rd party” voters complain about Democrats doing.
Also, for people who want to succeed it’s odd I only hear about “3rd party” in October every 4 years. I’m sure in January you’ll still be talking about the importance of building a 3rd party right?
Here’s the electoral reality. We have a first-past-the-post, winner-take-all system. There can only be two major parties at the same time. For the Greens to win, the Democrats have to lose.
Since the Democrats don’t want to lose, they’ll do everything they can to stop the Greens. They aren’t going to be doing anything to help us. They certainly aren’t going to be dispensing friendly advice that will help us defeat them.
I’ll be talking about the importance of building an alternative party, yes. At usual, Democrats are projecting. They expect people to vote and then go to sleep for four years.
I’ve can’t remember how many times I’ve heard a Democrat tell me how stressed they are about the election and they can’t wait for Harris to win so that they can go forget about politics again.
Greens are activists. We know that there’s going to be a lot of work to be done for the next four years, regardless of who wins.
And yet, if there was ever a time where that isn’t worth it, it’s when fascists have a high chance of winning. Trump is not a right wing liberal; he wants to destroy the liberal world order that America controls just so no one can threaten his dictatorial power at home.
That may seem like it could benefit leftists elsewhere, but he wants to go to war with neighbors and bully other countries even harder than the liberal empire did. Where the American empire leaves, the Russian empire will take its place. All the while, an old man with no desire to leave a lasting legacy for his family or country is in control of the most powerful war machine on earth.
any vote not for Harris is a vote for trump.
Not if they were gonna vote trump instead
Literally no. If they were gonna vote Trump instead but decided to go with Harris, their vote is worth the same as someone who would always vote Harris or the vote of a leftist who decided on damage reduction.
Any voting system flattens our personal motivations into a single action. Any statement you’re looking to make is moot unless you have a massive campaign to make it clear outside of the ballot box. Even then, the establishment can downplay and misinterpret your motivation as not being representative or as less important than what they want to believe.
There’s no better way to translate our will into results. Any system that doesn’t use free and fair voting can be tainted and colored by bias, making it impossible to ever undermine the will of the establishment. They will always choose to believe whatever is most convenient, but votes can deliver a reality shock that forces them to adjust their behavior, even if they never change their minds. The only other thing capable of that is violence.
Remember: the only people who say this want to see Trump win. You can vote with your conscience all you want, but it’s only mathematically possible for only one of two parties to get elected.
If third parties or independents actually wanted a shot, they’d put in the work outside of elections, building coalitions and locally from the ground up.
I am not american. Next I meet a yank, I will ask him.her what s.he voted for.
If they voted for genocide I will spit on their face.
They are all so against it but have no problem voting for it. It’s disgusting really. And they have the nerve to try make me look like the bad guy in this thread. There’s a bunch of shitty people here.
You’re not a “bad guy.” You just refuse to accept reality. A fool is not a villain, but they can cause comparable damage.
The reality is that humans are going to keep performing actions which limit their own survival.
Just think if everyone voted for what’s right and not because someone online is calling them a fool if they vote different.
Obviously you believe I’m not voting for what I think is right, except I actually am. I’m not Harris’ biggest fan and thought she was a mid Senator, but she was probably the conservative dem I would’ve been the least upset about in the 2020 primary. She’s far better than Biden, who only beat out the actually billionaires in my ranking.
On top of that, she manages to be the best option for president on the ballot in my state.
I despise the green party for focusing so exclusively on the presidency. It makes me think they aren’t serious about accomplishing anything outside of thoughts and prayers. On top of that, Stein is shit as an individual politician and my view of her worsens with every run.
The only other left wing 3rd party is the openly tankie party, and I’m not big on those that lend support to empires for simply not being American. I’m not voting for RFK Jr., Capitalists, or Homophobes, so Harris is actually the best choice in my view.
The president shouldn’t be as powerful or important, and quite frankly, we’ve been more successful working within the Democratic party than outside of it. The 2 party system will not go away without election reform done by working within the parties. It’s shit democracy, but the only right thing to do is play with the cards we’re dealt.
That’s probably the dumbest take I have read yet. If I wanted trump to win, I would vote for him.
Your motivation doesn’t matter, only the result of your action.
That’s a nihilistic argument. The result of human action is dying. If I had children, they will die one day regardless of what I do, regardless of what their other parent does, regardless of what their extended family does, regardless of what their teachers do, regardless of what society does.
And, yet, intentions matter. Someone voting third party because that’s what they believe in is not an immoral intention that destroys the universe.
I’m down for leaving people to vote for who they want, as long as they allow their protest votes to weigh heavily on their consciences when January comes around and we suddenly live in the fourth reich
I’ll never pretend to respect their decision. They might not even accept they were wrong when they’re inside the gas chambers. Besides, them feeling guilty is no justice for dooming people to death. It would be an injustice nobody could ever set right.
This comment has a dismissive tone to it. I’m not a fan.
I’m just being cheeky I don’t respect it either. Although I truly do hope it weighs on them
Either Harris or Trump are going to win the election. Not voting for Harris is voting for Trump. Yes, it fucking sucks, but especially if you’re a woman or a queer person, really think about whether you actually think it doesn’t matter which one wins.
Voting is not an endorsement of a candidate. It’s a tool. Don’t let them take away your rights while you’re waiting for the perfect candidate that will never come.
Harris will lose. A vote for harris is a vote for trump.
Charitable read: I think they’re talking in general, not just for the president. voting third party is actually pretty viable in certain areas of the country for certain state positions